Investing in Financial Expertise and Building Better Business Optics

Darryl [00:00:00]:
Today is a great day.

René [00:00:02]:
Every day is a great day, dude.

Darryl [00:00:04]:
True, but let me rewind a bit. So, exactly 365 days ago, my son Lucas won his very first golf tournament.

René [00:00:13]:
Oh, yeah, I remember.

Darryl [00:00:15]:
Except you remember the part where he's so damn humble that he didn't even tell me he won the tournament.

René [00:00:19]:
Yeah, I know.

Darryl [00:00:20]:
When I asked him, he's like, how was the tournament? Fine.

René [00:00:23]:
It was good.

Darryl [00:00:24]:
Yeah, just good?

René [00:00:24]:
Friggin kid.

Darryl [00:00:25]:
And then it took me 20 minutes and a bunch of questions to finally get it out of him that he won the tournament. So yesterday, he was back at that same tournament, and on the ride to the course, I gave him a little speech, and I was like, listen, it's okay to be humble, but it's okay to celebrate these moments, too. So.

René [00:00:42]:
No kidding, man.

Darryl [00:00:43]:
Yeah. If you and your friends win, it's okay to just, you know, take some pictures, celebrate, be happy. Tell us maybe that you won a tournament. So he gets to the course, and about an hour later, I get a text message, and it's a picture of his golf ball. And all it says is, "Hole in one. No big deal."

René [00:01:00]:
Oh, my God.

Darryl [00:01:01]:
So you know what I did? Cause I can't believe anything with my kids. And still no excitement. Yeah, well, I'm like, he's gotta be bullshitting. I think he's doing this. Cause I gave him a speech about, you know, take pictures, act like you're excited when something big happens. So I'm like, is this for real? He's like, yes.

René [00:01:19]:
There you go. So nothing's changed in a year.

Darryl [00:01:22]:
Yeah. And I'm like, no, but seriously, is this real? Cause I'm gonna post this on Instagram. And if you're bullshitting me, I'm gonna look like a real idiot having to go back and be like, no, he was just a joke. He sent more pictures. And, yes, he did get a hole in one.

René [00:01:34]:
That's pretty sweet, man. At 16 years old.

Darryl [00:01:36]:
Yeah, well, that. You know, and that's not the exciting part of today. Today, like. And I don't want to overshadow his hole in one, but I'm officially announcing my retirement... from golf. It's bad enough when your kid kicks your ass, but when he has a hole in one hanging over your head and I can't even hit the fairway, I'll be his caddy instead.

René [00:01:57]:
I didn't even know you were in the game.

Darryl [00:01:58]:
I hold the pencils. This is taming the hustle...

René [00:02:03]:
Or something of the sorts.

René [00:02:10]:
Congratulations, Lucas. That's amazing.

Darryl [00:02:28]:
No kidding. He still acts like it's no big deal. I'm like, we're gonna get that ball framed. And he's like, yeah, yeah, it's fine, it's fine. Then I'm like, what happened at the course? And he's like, well, they didn't take my picture because they want me to come back. They're gonna give me a flag and put my picture up and my name on their wall or whatever. And I'm like, that's super cool. And he's like, yeah, it's fine.

René [00:02:45]:
It's fine. It's because he knows he's gonna get many more, so.

Darryl [00:02:49]:
Maybe that's it.

René [00:02:50]:
Not get too excited about it.

Darryl [00:02:52]:
So, a few episodes ago, I talked about a friend of mine who doesn't use your service, and I have this conversation with other people as well who have their own financial planners or have their own advisors. They bitch about their finances, and I say, why don't you just #callRene? So I want to talk to you today about that. And I know you're speaking of humble. I know you don't like when I bring this shit up. And I say, hey, we should talk about how great you are, but let's just keep it general. I want you to talk about CFPs certified, and I have to stress 'certified' financial planners.

René [00:03:27]:
Well, you know, you go to the dentist, and it's kind of a given that your dentist is a dentist, right? But if he wasn't, you'd be running for the hills, and you wouldn't let him or her touch you.

Darryl [00:03:37]:
Exactly.

René [00:03:38]:
Same as your doctor or anybody else.

Darryl [00:03:40]:
You know what? I did have a dentist that I would have let her touch me, certified or not.

René [00:03:47]:
There you go. Sign me up. You know, we come across so many stories in our business. Yeah. Maybe I can mention a few just to kind of emphasize the importance of working with a professional. I mean, there's a whole bunch of, like, baby titles out there. I know the banking system. Like a PFP or something, which is a personal financial planner or something like that.

René [00:04:08]:
Like, I don't know. Doesn't matter. And I don't want to bash the banking system. It's. You know what? Because I've got friends and family that work at banks, and they're great people. It's the banking system itself. They don't really encourage education from what we've observed. Right.

René [00:04:22]:
So, you know, in terms of dedicating resources to properly training your staff.

Darryl [00:04:27]:
Yeah.

René [00:04:27]:
Is problematic with the banking system.

Darryl [00:04:29]:
Oh, for sure. You can see it in the job descriptions half the time.

René [00:04:32]:
Yeah, for sure. And then the pay grid usually isn't there either. So if, you know, are you going to work with someone that's going to have some skin in the game, or are you going to bring your $2 million portfolio to someone at the bank that, you know, might not even be full time? And there's nothing wrong with having a couple of gigs to make sure that you're putting some food on the table. Like, we love working with ambitious people that are willing to work hard, but at the same time, going back to your dentist, you're not going to go see a dentist that is a mechanic and is going to do dentistry as a side gig. Right. You want someone that's going to be devoted to their profession, that's going to excel at what they do, and you're going to be dealing with that person that knows their shit in their industry.

Darryl [00:05:13]:
Exactly.

René [00:05:14]:
So one of the ones that was quite comical just recently was we had a client of ours that had been, you know, kind of slowly transferring their assets over to us as their, you know, GICs matured at the bank and stuff. And there was a GIC that was coming due. So we had sent the client in to tell them not to renew it so that we can take, you know, the proper measures to get the assets transferred over. So then this young person was at the bank and couldn't find the client's file and couldn't find them on system and says, you'll have to excuse me, says, you know, I'm fairly new here, and I can only get 15 hours a week. So it's, you know, I'm just learning as quickly as I can so that, you know, apparently the kid was very nice and polite. But anyway, so finally they find the client's account and they look after businesses discussed. And then that evening, the client orders pizza, and the same guy delivers the pizza to the client's house and then goes on to say, he's got a third job.

Darryl [00:06:05]:
The worst part about that is, I think the bank promotes that as holistic financial plan. We take care of you with your finances, with delivering your pizza, everything.

René [00:06:14]:
Hey, and I've got friends that are pizza delivery guys. Like, I'm not bashing that at all, but I'm saying, if your dentist showed up at your house when you called an Uber, you'd kind of wonder, right, exactly. If you're not busy enough as a dentist that you need to drive an Uber. You know, it could be problematic.

Darryl [00:06:32]:
Yeah, well, it goes to the marketing end of things that I think about is that I preach, be an expert at what you do. And if you are the dentist and you're delivering pizza most of your hours, because you only get 15 hours a week, that's your financial planner. That's who you're putting faith in with all your money.

René [00:06:50]:
Absolutely. I mean, this episode is just to emphasize looking for expertise when you're looking to work with someone.

Darryl [00:06:57]:
Yes.

René [00:06:57]:
You know, another good example was we had another client, and the straw that broke the camel's back was the client had their assets with one of the big five. It's always a revolving door. Right. That's another thing. There's no continuity. If you have a certified financial planner who's made a career of what he does, he's going to develop meaningful relationships with the people that he works with, and he's going to have the expertise to bring some real value to the table.

Darryl [00:07:20]:
Yeah.

René [00:07:20]:
You know, people have this idea that they're paying more, and often we're even cheaper.

Darryl [00:07:24]:
Right, exactly.

René [00:07:25]:
And we talk about fees, and we disclose them so that clients know what they're getting paid for.

Darryl [00:07:29]:
I find it funny when people say that. They're like, oh, I don't pay my financial planner any fees at the bank. I'm like, yeah, you do. A shitload of them.

René [00:07:37]:
Some of the wealthiest industries in our country.

Darryl [00:07:39]:
Yeah, it's all buried. Like, they make it so. The wizard of Oz, the man behind the curtain, pulling all the strings to make it look like you're not paying fees when you really are.

René [00:07:49]:
They're all reported fees are there. They're in your fun facts. They're probably on your annual statement. No one seems to want to talk about them. And then you get this idea that you're not paying fees or that everything is super cheap just because you're dealing with one of the big five. Anyway, the straw that broke the camel's back for the client was that they were dealing with one of the big banks and wanted to book an appointment with their advisor, and they said, oh, you won't be able to meet with your advisor this week because your advisor's taken its license course, and you'll only be able to meet them next week. So it wasn't even licensed yet. So getting back to professionalism and having, you know, the right people in your court is like, let's use Ryan as an example.

Darryl [00:08:31]:
Ryan, who works in your office.

René [00:08:33]:
Ryan is an integral part of our organization. Ryan came to the table, was already securities commission licensed.

Darryl [00:08:40]:
Okay.

René [00:08:40]:
And I would say for, like, the first two to three years, we met with clients together.

Darryl [00:08:48]:
Yeah, exactly.

René [00:08:49]:
And we still do today because we're a really good team, and it just, like. It really adds a nice dynamic. But at the beginning, it was very intentional, is to make sure that Ryan wasn't just thrown to the wolves.

Darryl [00:08:59]:
Exactly.

René [00:09:00]:
Right. Because now, all of a sudden, the client loses confidence that we know what we're doing. And then Ryan gets kind of cornered because he's forced to be in front of clients when he hasn't developed that skillset yet.

René [00:09:11]:
But now working collectively with him this entire time, Ryan is just an extension of who I am and what I do.

Darryl [00:09:19]:
Yeah, exactly.

René [00:09:19]:
So to reiterate all that is how important it is to work with a team that is taking this industry seriously, that is going to develop the right skillset and is going to excel at what they do. And you're not dealing with someone that's got a side gig, that has no accreditation, has no real experience in the business.

Darryl [00:09:41]:
Yeah.

René [00:09:42]:
So be very selective of who you work with, because you're paying for a service. You should be expecting quality service.

Darryl [00:09:48]:
Yeah.

René [00:09:49]:
If your plumber couldn't fix your plumbing, you definitely wouldn't hire that plumber again.

Darryl [00:09:53]:
Exactly.

René [00:09:53]:
Another interesting comment that I heard recently was we were transferring assets again from another brokerage firm.

Darryl [00:09:59]:
Yeah.

René [00:09:59]:
And we called the advisor because we were having trouble moving this client's RRSP over, and we asked for some help with the paperwork because apparently his institution was having issues with something, and he flat out says, hey, listen, I don't have time for this stuff, man. This is my side gig.

Darryl [00:10:13]:
The bank person said that?

René [00:10:16]:
Yeah, from another firm. It wasn't. It wasn't a bank in this case. So it's not unique to the banking industry. You have to be careful who you're working with.

Darryl [00:10:24]:
Exactly.

René [00:10:25]:
So advisor to advisor, he's like, hey, man, like, I don't have time for this shit. This is my side gig.

Darryl [00:10:30]:
Oh, my God.

René [00:10:31]:
Oh, my God.

Darryl [00:10:32]:
It's so frustrating.

René [00:10:33]:
See, I don't find it super frustrating in terms of, you know, for me having to work with people like that. But what I find really sad is that people settle for less, I don't know if it's a comfort thing.

Darryl [00:10:44]:
Yeah.

René [00:10:44]:
You know, for me, it was RBC, because when I was a kid, my father had always worked with RBC. He was very loyal to them and is to this day. So I opened an RBC account and then you just kind of become complacent because you already have an account there, and you just, I don't know, is it creatures of habit? Is it comfort? Is it, you know, because they're the big banks that are making piles of money, that they're, I don't know, we feel more confident in them.

Darryl [00:11:06]:
I've been guilty of it long ago, luckily, but when we first had Lucas, actually, we were renewing our mortgage with the bank because they had the lowest rate at the time. And we went in and we're talking with him, and he says, oh, you have a, you know, you got newborn baby, and he says, we should set up an resp for you. And I said, oh, you know, my best friend's a financial planner, and he's like, it doesn't cost you anything. We can just do it here. And it, you know, as your check rolls in, and it's the same thing. Doesn't matter if you do with him or with me. And so we're like, okay, you know what? Yeah, sure. Let's just open one up.

Darryl [00:11:35]:
It's fine. And so we did. And then after a couple years, I'm like, literally, it's not growing at all. And then I asked you, I said, hey, listen, I have this, you know, stupid resp at the bank, and, like, it literally hasn't grown, not even a penny.

René [00:11:49]:
They had never invested it for you?

Darryl [00:11:51]:
No. And so when I called him, I said, I want to pull this out. He's like, oh, why? It's doing so well. And I was like, what are you talking about? It's the same amount that we put in. And he's like, oh, let me. Let me check my file. You know what? Actually, let me go ask somebody about this. And that's when I realized that if you are at the bank or a different firm or something, and your expert, it's fine to not know all the answers.

Darryl [00:12:14]:
But at the same time, when you're asking simple questions about your finances, the future of your wealth, and someone says, you know what? I'm not sure. I'm going to have to go. Let me go research that. Let me go ask my manager about that. That drives me crazy.

René [00:12:29]:
Well, everyone has to learn, though. That's the thing. But if you had the right system in place. To train and educate and have some mentorship that would make leaps and bounds in the level of service and quality of service that you have, but it just doesn't seem to be happening. We do tax preparation for people that work in the banking system. And we had someone who was supposed to be an advisor ask us as their tax preparer if they should be doing RSPs or not.

Darryl [00:12:54]:
Oh, my God.

René [00:12:56]:
You know, like, and super nice person.

Darryl [00:12:59]:
Yeah.

René [00:12:59]:
It's just the banking system is not training him and not teaching him the fundamental skills to do what we do. Right. So.

Darryl [00:13:05]:
Yeah. Well, I have a friend who's just like your dad and very loyal to his bank, and I've had this conversation with him countless times of him, like, you need to call René. And if it's not René, call somebody else. Don't work with this person. And when I say person at the bank, he's had. He's. He's my age. He's in his forties.

Darryl [00:13:23]:
So he's, what? Been investing for 20 years. He's had 18 different advisors at the bank, and somehow he still trusts that all these new people come in, know exactly what's best for him. A while ago, I said, okay, just do me a favor. I said, I'm going to send you an email that just has a list of what a real certified financial planner has to do to not only become certified, but to stay certified. And I said, I want you to ask your. Whoever it is at the bank today, who's your advisor, what their education is, what kind of certifications they need, and when they have to renew them. And he says, fine, I'll take that challenge. So I sent him a list of everything that you would do in the courses.

Darryl [00:14:02]:
You know, how you got to take those credits and do those courses. And he went and researched his bank and asked, you know, what kind of certification? And when he came back, he's like, oh, well, you know, she doesn't have the full certification right now. She did the two weekend courses, and she has one more to do, and then she'll be certified. And I'm like, and just you saying that, isn't that a red flag already? It makes no sense to me. I'm like, you are putting all your future wealth in their hands, and you're willing to go with somebody. And again, nothing against, everybody needs a job, and everybody's, you know, has a skill set. But like you said, when these people are part time, when they're not fully certified or know the industry as well as they should, that's dangerous, as far as I'm concerned.

René [00:14:47]:
Yeah, there's a huge hole in the banking system.

Darryl [00:14:49]:
Yeah, and that's where all your money goes, is into that hole.

René [00:14:53]:
You know, going back to the story with my father is that, you know, they looked after you like, if you had money, they'd negotiate interest rates.

Darryl [00:14:59]:
Exactly.

René [00:15:00]:
If you had been a really good customer and had, you know, always paid your bills and everything, they'd be more willing to give you a better interest rate on a mortgage or whatever. Right. And they cared about the people that was working for them.

Darryl [00:15:12]:
Yeah.

René [00:15:12]:
And now it just seems. I don't know, maybe I'm wrong, but it just seems it's just shareholder driven.

Darryl [00:15:18]:
Oh, 100%, yeah.

René [00:15:19]:
And they don't care about their client and they don't care about their staff. And I think that that's very sad.

Darryl [00:15:24]:
I agree.

René [00:15:25]:
As a result of that, people are not being educated, they're not being mentored. Right. You need some leadership. Right. To train and, you know, to help people develop those skills.

Darryl [00:15:33]:
So let me ask you this. If I'm. I'm not Darryl Boulley right now. I'm just a stranger and I'm listening to this podcast, and I say, okay, I'm going to try to find somebody who's the right certified financial planner. What question should I be asking?

René [00:15:48]:
Well, you can ask them if they're a CFP.

Darryl [00:15:50]:
Yeah.

René [00:15:50]:
Right. Because it should be at the end of their name and on their business card or on the website or whatever. You can actually look at the CFP Canada website and you'll get a listing of who's a CFP and who's not, you know, asking them how long they've been in business, too. Right. Because, you know, I also started from nothing in 1999. Right. So it's. I'm not trying to condone someone who's trying to learn the business and develop a skill.

René [00:16:15]:
You know, going back to the Ryan example is just if you're properly mentored and you're willing to learn the business, you know, I would invest all of my money with Ryan. He's a brilliant young man. But if you ask someone. Okay, well, are you a CFP? No, I'm not. Well, how long have you been in the industry? If someone's been in the industry for ten years and they're still not a CFP, it means they're not really dedicated enough to learn the industry well enough to be a true expert. They're just kind of trek along. Right.

Darryl [00:16:44]:
Gotcha.

René [00:16:45]:
And I see that as problematic.

Darryl [00:16:46]:
Yeah, for sure.

René [00:16:47]:
When I went for my final exam, like, it's same as when you become a CPA is. It's a government exam that is held just every six months, and if you fail it, you have to wait another six months for an attempt. And I think you're limited on the amount of attempts, and I can't remember. I got mine in 2004. So they wouldn't actually tell you what your grade is. You just had to be the top 40%. Otherwise they failed you. So they only allowed certain amount of people to pass every six months.

Darryl [00:17:14]:
Oh, crazy.

René [00:17:15]:
I got mine on my first attempt by busting my balls. And I made it happen.

Darryl [00:17:21]:
Nice.

René [00:17:21]:
So I guess my long winded answer to your question is just ask questions, right? Ask them if they're a CFP. Ask them how long they've been in business. And you know what we offer from time to time, if we think a client really wants us to demonstrate our skillset, we'll offer referrals. We'll ask clients that are either in similar industries as the clients that we're looking to work with or same kind of career path, or maybe same age bracket or demographic or whatever. Then they get testimonials from people that have been working with us for 5, 10, 20 years. Right?

Darryl [00:17:51]:
Yeah. Yeah. You know, just to finish this off, I think another important question is, I'm going to order pizza tonight. Is there any chance you're going to be delivering it? Because that's an important fact.

René [00:18:02]:
You'll also get a pretty good vibe from the person when you first start talking to them to see if they're actually vested in your best interest and wanting to vest in developing a relationship instead of it being just transactional.

Darryl [00:18:14]:
Yeah. And you have to be aware of the car salesman approach versus authentic approach.

René [00:18:21]:
Absolutely.

Darryl [00:18:22]:
We'll be right back.

Darryl [00:18:38]:
Now, I don't want you to think I'm stealing your idea, but I want to take your topic a step further. And I want us to dive into the world of optics and how they can significantly impact your marketing efforts.

René [00:18:51]:
Please do tell.

Darryl [00:18:52]:
So, when I talk about optics, I'm referring to the perception of your business in the eyes of your customers. And it's about how your business looks and feels and is experienced by those who interact with it, much like we were talking about earlier with the people at the banks. And the same goes for any company, big or small, optics can make or break your business. So I want to start with an example again. I feel like I'm stealing your idea here because you gave.

René [00:19:16]:
Just run with it, man. Run with it.

Darryl [00:19:18]:
Now I'm giving examples.

René [00:19:19]:
I had fucking really great examples today.

Darryl [00:19:22]:
You did, you did.

René [00:19:22]:
You're going to have to work hard to top me.

Darryl [00:19:24]:
I'll try. But I want to start with an example that we all know, and that's taxis.

René [00:19:29]:
Okay?

Darryl [00:19:30]:
The whole uber versus taxicabs. So over the past decade, or little, even a little more, Uber has managed to take over traditional taxis in many cities around the world. Why? Well, the one key reason is optics of cost and transparency. When you take a taxi, you often don't know the final fare until you reach your destination, right?

René [00:19:50]:
Yeah.

Darryl [00:19:50]:
And no disrespect to good taxi drivers out there, but we all know that most of them have been known to take longer routes. They drive slower than the speed limit just to increase that fare. And this easily creates that negative perception that I'm talking about amongst customers. But now, in contrast to that, Uber comes in and everyone is like, oh, who's this Uber? And they offer a flat rate and you know it up front before you get in the car, you know what you're paying. And that gives the customers a sense of control and trust, right?

René [00:20:21]:
Absolutely.

Darryl [00:20:22]:
And it allows the customers to know that they're not being taken advantage of. They know the driver is not going to drive super slow. They know they're not going to take the big, long route. Especially when you're in a different city and you don't know that city. You know, you land in New York and you've never been there and you're like, I want to go to the Empire State building.

René [00:20:39]:
Uber will actually get you there faster because they want to get onto the next gig to make more money.

Darryl [00:20:44]:
Exactly. And that's no different than like this whole shrinkflation thing. How many videos have you seen online lately? People bitching about the size of their cracker box shrinking and the price going up. People will stop buying simply because of things like that, like the cab driver taking the long route. If you try to fool people, it won't work. Another crucial aspect of optics is the behavior and attitude of the owner and employees. So imagine walking into a store where the staff is unfriendly, unhelpful, or just fucking downright rude. No matter how good your product or service is, a negative interaction with you or one of your team members, it tarnishes the entire customer experience.

René [00:21:22]:
Oh, dude!

Darryl [00:21:23]:
You've been there. You've seen it. I've seen it. Everyone's seen it.

René [00:21:25]:
We were highly recommended to go to a steakhouse in the city when we were once traveling. This is last winter. Meg says I'm never going back there again. It's just like, we couldn't get anyone to look at us, that we're making eye contact. Doesn't matter how good the food could have been, it was the worst experience. We couldn't get out of there fast enough.

Darryl [00:21:46]:
And those are the faces of your business, right?

René [00:21:49]:
Yeah. We corked the wine, and we finished our wine at the hotel. We didn't stick around. Usually you got a nice atmosphere, you want to stick around.

Darryl [00:21:56]:
And it just doesn't go for inside your business. Like, it happens outside your business, too. Like, if you're a crazy aggressive driver and you have the logo of your plumbing business on the side of your truck, and you cut me off or you're tailgating me, do you think I'm going to hire you to fix my shower or toilet? Hell, no.

René [00:22:13]:
Yeah.

Darryl [00:22:13]:
Do you think somebody else who's watching that is going to.

René [00:22:15]:
If you're causing me road rage, I'm not calling you to fix my faucet.

Darryl [00:22:19]:
Exactly. It's like, and this negative perception spreads quickly, especially in our age of social media, where one bad review can reach hundreds or thousands of people who are potential customers.

René [00:22:31]:
Even in my business imagine if I'm walking through the aisles of the grocery store with my nose up in the air because I don't want to talk to anyone.

Darryl [00:22:38]:
Hundred percent.

René [00:22:38]:
Right. It just, it just leaves that sour taste in your mouth.

Darryl [00:22:41]:
Yeah, it's, we see it often. That's why I said I feel like I was piggybacking your topic, because the perception, just like you said, it's like when that advisor from the bank came and delivered that guy's pizza. Those optics right there, it's like, oh, my God, my money is with you. This is insane.

René [00:22:59]:
Yeah, it is. When you think about it, it's insane.

Darryl [00:23:03]:
So you have to think about this stuff with your business, and you have to sit down and think about, you know, what does it look like? Think about when you walk into a tech store. If you're looking for a new laptop, you ask a salesperson for a recommendation. If they seem unsure or they can't answer your questions about a different model, its that lack of expertise that not only frustrates the fuck out of you, but now you, as the customer, begins to question the credibility of the entire store just because of that one salesperson.

René [00:23:30]:
Yeah, I've actually like, I really like Best Buy for that because usually they know their stuff pretty well, but I it's happened to me before. I'm like, can you go get someone that knows something about this. Like, you might be good with tvs, but you don't know anything about printers.

Darryl [00:23:42]:
Like, yeah, that's. Well, and Home Depot is famous for this, of hiring people for the different departments that have experience. So, like, in plumbing, they'll hire. You see the old guy there? He's a retired plumber.

René [00:23:54]:
Yeah. Knows his stuff.

Darryl [00:23:56]:
I know it's his part time job, but he's an expert at it.

René [00:23:58]:
Optics.

Darryl [00:23:59]:
One last point that you brought up is that expertise and exactly what I just said about Home Depot. Whether you're the business owner or an employee, not being knowledgeable about your own products or service, that damages your business, that damages your brand. And those business optics are just horrible because customers expect you to be the expert in what you're selling. And we see this all the time with people who are like, I have an idea and I want to open a business, but it's not their passion, it's not what they love to do. They're just like, oh, I think this is a great idea. And then when customers start to go there because they're like, oh, this is all right, and they find out the owner knows nothing about what they're doing, right away you can see the optics. Just change the root and success of that business and it starts to dwindle. Right.

René [00:24:44]:
What I've seen before that's made me chuckle is like. Like a Ford salesman that drives a GM.

Darryl [00:24:49]:
Exactly.

René [00:24:51]:
You don't even believe in your own product. Yeah, it's going to be a hard sell.

Darryl [00:24:54]:
There's a Honda dealership just not far from our house. I feel like I want to go in there and be like, pay me for ten minutes and I'm going to change the perception of your business. Because out front on the one side, it says employee parking, and there's not one Honda in the employee parking. I'm like, every time I drive by, I'm like, why would I go in there? I know Honda is a good brand, but I'm like, why would I go in there when you guys don't drive them?

René [00:25:22]:
Yeah, here's your sign.

Darryl [00:25:23]:
To me, that tells me that even the employees can't afford your cars. That's what it tells me. I know the brand's good. We know they have a good thing. But if the employees aren't driving it, like, even with their discount, they can't afford it. So the prices there must be high. I'm not even going to stop in to find out.

René [00:25:39]:
That's funny.

Darryl [00:25:40]:
So how can you ensure your business optics are positive and working to your advantage. The first is transparency. Be clear and upfront about your pricing, your policies, your processes, just like Uber does. Just like you do. Transparency builds that trust with customers, right? Makes them feel secure about their decision. Like that meeting, like you say with you and Ryan, where you go in with a customer. When Ryan was new, you went into the meeting and were like, this is Ryan. You know, he's new to our team.

Darryl [00:26:07]:
He's learning. I'm here for you, but Ryan's here to kind of learn the ropes. It's transparency. That's great. I'm glad he's here. He's going to learn this shit. And in, you know, ten years, he's taken over my account or whatever the case may be, right?

René [00:26:21]:
Yeah, absolutely.

Darryl [00:26:22]:
Which leads into train your employees. Invest in training your employees to be not not only knowledgeable, but friendly and helpful. And for the love of God, be fucking knowledgeable.

René [00:26:35]:
You know what? That is a clear sign of good leadership. When you have the ability and you have the team that's built with some skill set and some empathy and some authenticity.

Darryl [00:26:45]:
Oh, 100%.

René [00:26:46]:
You have poor leadership. You know, I don't understand some of the businesses. Sometimes I just like, how do they even stay open?

Darryl [00:26:54]:
Well, that's the thing. Being in business means continuously learning, right? And staying up to date with industry trends. If you see something that's going to affect your business, if you don't adjust what you're doing to make it right for your customers, they're going to go somewhere else. And lastly, listen and respond to customer feedback. And when I say respond, respond with words and actions. One thing that drives me crazy is I have clients like this where they'll message me and be like, I got a bad review on Google. How do we take it down? And I'm like, well, one, you don't take it down like that's. It's there for life.

Darryl [00:27:27]:
Whatever you've done wrong, you need to fix it. And so they're like, okay, and we'll talk about how should we respond? And so they will respond back on Google. And it's like, you know, whatever the case may be, it's like, oh, the worker was really rude. You know, they, they were messy, they were rude, whatever. And they go on and they'll write their nice message and say, you know, we're definitely going to look into this. This is not our standard, blah, blah, blah. And then I'll say to the client, okay, now do it. Obviously, you got to go talk to this guy and fix it.

Darryl [00:27:55]:
And it's like, oh no, he's a good worker. I'm not going to bother him with that. He's just going to piss him off.

René [00:27:59]:
Yeah.

Darryl [00:28:00]:
I'm like, he's just going to be rude to the next person then.

René [00:28:02]:
Just who he is.

Darryl [00:28:03]:
Yeah, just who he is. Okay, well, fuck, if you don't fix it, you're going to get more of these reviews and it's great that you're responding. When I go and look at reviews, yes, I look at a bunch of them and I always go to the bad ones. And if I see that the problem is consistent, they haven't cared. They don't give a shit.

René [00:28:19]:
Very good points, Mr. Boulley.

Darryl [00:28:21]:
Thanks.

René [00:28:22]:
I appreciate you.

Darryl [00:28:22]:
So remember, the way your business is perceived can significantly impact your success. So by focusing on like what I said, transparency, employee training, expertise, be consistent with your branding and customer feedback. You can ensure the optics of your business are always positive. All right, that's it for me. Don't be stupid. It's so fucking simple. We'll be right back.

Darryl [00:28:59]:
Since we've already chatted about a few things that resonate with everyone already, I'd like to continue that. And regardless of age, profession or lifestyle, I want to talk about the art of saying no.

René [00:29:11]:
Oh yeah.

Darryl [00:29:11]:
And no. I'm not talking about our wives, because they become masters at this. I'm talking about how setting boundaries can be challenging, especially without the guilt that often accompanies it. So why is it so hard to say no? I know for me, I often feel pressured to agree to everything because I. And we've had this conversation many times. I don't want to disappoint people.

René [00:29:34]:
We're in the service industry. It's really, really difficult to say no and set boundaries. And I don't think that challenge is ever going away.

Darryl [00:29:41]:
No, and the thing is, I've learned that constantly saying yes really can lead to burnout and stress and resentment. I know people who constantly ask me for stuff all the time and it's like, at this point I do resent them because it's like, holy crap, at some point are you ever not gonna need me?

René [00:29:57]:
I don't know. I'm guilty of it too dude.

René [00:29:58]:
I don't think I have the answer for you today. Show's over.

Darryl [00:30:01]:
I guess that's it.

René [00:30:04]:
You know, I was brought up as a pleaser. I mean, that's just the kind of household we were brought up in is just. You laid a helping hand to your neighbor before they had to ask. Right. Because you saw that they needed help lifting something or whatever. And being in the service industry, you're always wanting to go above and beyond to, you know, have that level of service that we were talking about earlier.

Darryl [00:30:26]:
Yeah.

René [00:30:26]:
And that I think that translates into our personal life a lot as well, too. You know, I would say for the most part, I'm okay with saying yes because I find it rewarding to help. But like you said earlier, and that really resonated with me, is that, you know, some people seem to take advantage of you, right? Because you're always willing to help, but nothing in return. Right? So all of a sudden you need help and there's no issue saying no, or I'm busy or, sorry, man, not around that weekend or whatever, you know?

Darryl [00:30:56]:
Well, that's the thing. I think it's very hard to come up with ways to say no. And over the years, I've learned to say no. And it's essential, I think, for my own mental health and personal boundaries. And I've come up with a few ways that work for me. Like I said, it's so hard to say no sometimes. And even if you want to, if it's that person taking advantage of you, or there's things like, I've been invited to dinner parties where I just don't have time. I feel bad saying no.

Darryl [00:31:22]:
And when you just come out and say a flat out no.

René [00:31:25]:
You just gotta add fuck at the beginning and just say fuck no.

Darryl [00:31:28]:
Yeah.

René [00:31:28]:
Just make it super clear this is non negotiable.

Darryl [00:31:33]:
Well, the way I try to do it is I use what I call the sandwich approach and I frame the no between two positive statements. So what I mean by that is, it's like, I appreciate you thinking of me. I pat them on the back. I appreciate you thinking of me. I love it, it's very nice. But I can't take on another project right now. There's my no, but I'm sure somebody else can handle it. Like you probably know somebody else, you're smart enough.

Darryl [00:31:57]:
You know somebody else. I take those two positive and sandwich the no right in the middle.

René [00:32:00]:
Or even send them a referral because I've done that before too.

Darryl [00:32:04]:
Well, that's the thing, I do that as well, is the. It's the alternative, right? Instead of that flat out no, I try to always suggest a compromise. It's like, if you can't attend an event, like, like I said, a dinner party, it's, I can't make it this weekend, but can we catch up for coffee next week? It makes that no feel a little lighter. It's like, I can't do it this weekend, but, yeah. Can we catch up for coffee? It makes it feel so much better. Right? Like you still care.

René [00:32:28]:
Okay, so let me, let me, uh, let me test that one.

Darryl [00:32:30]:
Okay.

René [00:32:31]:
So I can't take on this new client. So I say, I'm flattered that you reached out, but I won't be able to take on your file at this time. But maybe you can contact your pizza delivery guy.

Darryl [00:32:43]:
It's a good alternative. And there's two phone numbers. They can contact them at the bank or the pizza parlour.

René [00:32:50]:
Yeah, there you go. I still think fuck no is the best, but.

Darryl [00:32:56]:
Well, one thing you do that I think is great, and I'm still trying to practice this. I practice it all the time. And that's assertive body language and tone. I am so bad for this, where someone will ask me that. And if we are face to face, can you come to my dinner party? I feel like my body language is screaming that I'm insecure and I'm ready to, like, I'm having trouble telling you this. My tone I'm getting better at is I can't make it this weekend, but let's catch up for coffee. But it's the whole body language.

René [00:33:23]:
We've been at fucking clothing stores where you decide you didn't want the pants and you almost buy the fucking pants because you can't say no to the friggin twelve year old girl working behind the counter. I'm like, Darryl, you don't want the fucking pants. Let's go. Holy Jesus.

Darryl [00:33:38]:
I'm working on it.

René [00:33:39]:
That is true, I never really thought of that, but that is very true.

Darryl [00:33:42]:
Oh, yeah. You're like, people will come up to you. That's a clothing star is perfect. When we go shopping, it's like someone comes up to you and they come up all aggressive and they're like, hey, you know that you would look good with those pair of pants that you have in your hand? Is this shirt. And you're like, no, it doesn't.

René [00:33:58]:
I know what I like.

Darryl [00:33:59]:
Yeah. You're like, that's not, that's not my style at all. But thank you. You. Thank you. If I need you, I'll definitely come give you a call.

René [00:34:04]:
Yeah.

Darryl [00:34:05]:
It's like you just turn them down and you look confident, and you were, you know, you were still polite, but your body language and tone just said, hey, no.

René [00:34:14]:
Affirmation. Yeah, yeah.

Darryl [00:34:16]:
Or sorry, I should say. Your body language and tone just said, oh, fuck, no.

René [00:34:21]:
Yeah, yeah. You say one more thing to you, I'm buying nothing. That's what my body was saying. Shut up. Shut right now. It is a real problem.

Darryl [00:34:33]:
I know, I know. I have. I definitely have problems with that. I'm always saying sorry to people. I'm always generally. I'll say yes to almost anything, but I've gotten better over the years.

René [00:34:44]:
You say sorry way too much.

Darryl [00:34:46]:
Oh, I'm sorry.

René [00:34:46]:
I'm surprised you've stopped saying it on the program. Honestly, I'm proud of you.

Darryl [00:34:50]:
Well, you know why? Because it's a lot of editing when I do because I say sorry, and you're like, would you fucking stop saying sorry? And I have to edit all those out. So if I don't say sorry on the podcast, I don't have to edit any of that out.

René [00:35:03]:
There you go. So now you just gotta get used to saying no.

Darryl [00:35:05]:
I know. Well, that's it. That's all we got.

René [00:35:08]:
Always a slice.

Darryl [00:35:08]:
Of pizza from your financial planner.

René [00:35:12]:
It's actually a thing. I can't believe it.

Darryl [00:35:14]:
Take care.