Level Up Marketing and Transferring Assets

Darryl:
I know we recently talked about false advertising.

René:
That's not false.

Darryl:
But have you ever seen those commercials on TV that are just straight up lying to you? Like, I'm talking full on fantasy world.

René:
I like fantasy.

Darryl:
See, I like fantasy, too. But this commercial, it's been on for a while, and every time I see it, I get angrier and angrier and it's that Levi's Beyonce ad. Have you seen it?

René:
No. I'm so out of the loop with TV commercials, it's crazy.

Darryl:
Well, you'll be thankful, because this ad that I'm talking about is the one where she's in a laundromat. She's got her Levi's on, she casually strips down into her tighty whities in the middle of the laundromat, throws it in the wash, and she's sitting there in like a bra and underwear, waiting for her clothes. Let me tell you, I have spent a lot of time in laundromats in my early 20s, and the closest I ever got to that experience was like a 65 year old Italian woman holding up a giant bra like she's sailing on the fucking Mediterranean.

René:
In her granny panties. Wouldn't it be amazing if that happened, though?

Darryl:
If Beyonce walked into a laundromat. Yeah. And stripped down, eyes bugging out of your head like Bugs Bunny.

René:
What is going on right now?

Darryl:
But I'm going to put this out there. I'm going to put it out into the world, see if anything comes from it. If Beyonce wants to do a real commercial, like, nothing misleading, I will give her the real Laundromat experience. Like, I know a place. I know the place. I used to go there in my 20s. It's got the broken change machine. You know that sketchy guy named Tony who sells single cigarettes in the dryer that either shrinks your clothes or literally sets them on fire?

René:
Oh, yeah, there you go.

Darryl:
This is Taming the Hustle...

René:
Or Something of the Sorts

Darryl:
She's just so, so ridiculously perfect.

René:
She's also Photoshopped.

Darryl:
She is. She is. But at the same time, like Jesus. Like that. Well, when I watch that ad, I yell Jesus. My wife's not sure if I'm praying to him or if I'm cursing him.

René:
Yeah.

Darryl:
All right. Speaking of marketing, let's talk about something that keeps small business owners up at night. And it's not caffeine, not self Doubt or pornhub. It's simply marketing. Specifically, when the hell do you stop doing it yourself and hand it over to a professional?

René:
I've been there, man. I've been there.

Darryl:
I got the call.

René:
It's worth it though.

Darryl:
Yeah, my bat phone rang and I picked it up.

René:
You're more like a Spider-Man to me than Batman. Great powers come great responsibilities, Darryl.

Darryl:
Yeah, I'm more sensitive like Spider-Man.

René:
Yes, yes, you are. You are sensitive. Spidey senses.

Darryl:
It's my spidey sense time of the month. So I know I've touched on this topic in a few past episodes, but today I'm going to get into a little more of the nitty gritty of it.

René:
Let's get into the weeds.

Darryl:
Yeah. As a small business owner, chances are you started doing everything yourself. Social media, website updates, email campaigns, maybe even designing your own logo in Microsoft paint. Which if you did do that and still have the same logo today, means you have friends and family that are fucking liars. It is a terrible logo. Do not believe them.

René:
Believe that.

Darryl:
But at first that's all fine. Generally you can get away with it. When you're first starting your business. Is it great? No, but it's fine. And I stress that it's fine. You don't want to grow your business on the term it's fine.

René:
No, I agree with that. Fine is not fine.

Darryl:
Well, exactly. And starting a business is hard. You're trying to save money and honestly, who else is going to do the marketing and branding for you? Nobody.

René:
You're a one man show at the beginning in many cases. I know sometimes you come into a business and you buy a business that has employees and people in place that are already doing this. But for small businesses, like you're talking about is often you're the one man show. I remember explaining to my team when I first started, I was like the homeless guy playing music on the sidewalk there and he's got his feet are the drums and he's playing the guitar and the harmonica and he's banging his head to go have the cowbell go.

Darryl:
And he's got the symbols between his knees.

René:
It's true. You're marketing. You answer the phone, you're the janitor, you're running the core of the business, you're buying supplies, you're everything. It's crazy.

Darryl:
But at some point your DIY marketing efforts start to feel less like money saving strategies and more like a creative breakdown waiting to happen.

René:
Or a burden on your day too. Right?

Darryl:
100%.

René:
There's something to be said of focusing on your business, which we brought up in past episodes.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
Pay someone to do the shit that you're not a professional at.

Darryl:
Yes. So I want to answer some of the big questions I get on a regular basis from small business owners, especially those starting out. And it's when is the right time to transition to a professional? Should I hire an agency for little things or let them take over everything? And most importantly, how do I know if I can even afford it? So the first thing is recognizing the signs that it is time to hand it over. DIY marketing is great until it isn't. And I see some dead giveaways sometimes that it might be time to call in the pros. One is if you've been posting Happy Friday on your business page every Friday for the last three months because you don't have time to create actual content. It's time.

René:
Here's your sign.

Darryl:
Yeah, your website still has a coming soon on half the pages and it's been three years.

René:
Here's your sign.

Darryl:
Yeah, you have amazing products or service, but your branding looks like a high school PowerPoint project.

René:
Here's your sign.

Darryl:
Again, it's time. You're spending so much time trying to figure out an algorithm that you know nothing about..

René:
You don't even know what an algorithm is.

Darryl:
You stop focusing on your actual business to figure out something you know nothing about or even what it is. This is the biggest dead giveaway I see.

René:
Here's your sign.

Darryl:
So if this sounds familiar, congratulations, you've reached the this is no longer sustainable phase of DIY marketing. Which leads me to the next big question I get. How much help do I really need?

René:
That's a tough one.

Darryl:
It is a tough one. Now, before you go out and hire a full service marketing agency to do everything, which, let's be honest, sounds like a dream, you need to figure out what you actually need help with. And most small businesses, there's two things to consider. One, the I just need a little help approach, which means you're decent at social media, but you need help with ads and strategies. You can write an email, but they're not converting. You designed your own logo, but deep down you know it's bad. If this is you hiring a freelancer or an agency for specific tasks like running Facebook ads or designing a brand refresh is a great option. And for those of you who are saying, oh, I can't change my bad logo, it's our identity, shut up, shut your face right now.

René:
Shut your mouth.

Darryl:
A brand refresh is sometimes more important to the process and strategy. So this I just need a little help approach could be for you. The other one is I need someone to take this off my plate approach, which is what you did. You hate marketing. You would rather wrestle a fucking bear than write an Instagram caption.

René:
I actually love marketing. Just not good at it. I love the topic, I love talking about it. Brainstorming about it. I just can execute it.

Darryl:
Exactly. If your website is outdated, your emails go unread and you're still using Comic Sans font everywhere, and I hate you for it.

René:
We actually have a branded font.

Darryl:
Which is good. You know how many people use Comic Sans? It's embarrassing.

René:
It's all in the little details, man. Subconsciously, people see it, but it's important.

Darryl:
Oh, yeah, but this, take this off my plate approach, if this is you, it's time to hire a marketing agency to handle everything. Social media, branding, website strategy, the whole package. And yes, it costs more, but it also means that your messaging will be consistent and actually effective. And with the right team, you'll see a return on investment.

René:
Yeah. And the time that you're saving on the marketing piece that you're not actually working on and you're focusing on your business is going to drive revenue, which is, in time, should pay more than the marketing cost.

Darryl:
Well, which brings me to the can I afford it? Question. Because hiring an agency for help sounds great until you remember that money is a thing and it exists. So here's a simple way to figure out if it's time to invest. If your DIY marketing is costing you sales, it's already too expensive. And what I mean by that is if your marketing is so bad or outdated or just not landing, you're losing potential sales. If you're spending more time on marketing than running your business, again, you're losing money. If your competitors are showing up everywhere and you're not not, you gotta level up. And we've talked about marketing budgets before, and I've worked with companies that said we can't afford an agency.

Darryl:
And then we help them do an audit type assessment and we see that they keep spending money hand over fist to keep adding new products or new services or a shitload of wasted Facebook ads that they're doing that just aren't landing when they haven't secured their target market yet. So let's say you're a cafe. They have a great product in their coffee, their lattes and their teas, but they're having trouble getting the word out right? So they decide, I need something to get people in here. So in their mind, they're like, I'm going to sell hoodies and hats because we really have a cool logo. I can make this work. So you spend a bunch of money making these products, and you put them on the shelves and still no one comes. Then you say, you know what? Maybe if we did. Branded Yeti travel mugs.

Darryl:
Everyone loves a good Yeti mug. So you drop a ton of cash and you get them nicely printed. They're sitting on the shelf and they're still collecting dust. Then you're. Now you're saying, you're like, I don't understand. I don't understand why we're not getting the business. And then you're like, oh, I have this grand idea. What if we added food to the menu? Maybe it's sandwiches, maybe it's wraps, maybe it's French fries.

Darryl:
I don't know. So you drop a bunch of cash on equipment and supplies, and still no one comes because you haven't fucking marketed yet.

René:
Yeah, you can be amazing at what you do. You can have an amazing product, but if no one knows you exist, it doesn't fucking matter.

Darryl:
Exactly. So let's say on these additions, you spent five or ten grand. Well, you could have used that to hire an agency to help you get the word out about how good your coffees and lattes and teas are. Then all of a sudden you have more customers, which means more money.

René:
More money is where it's at.

Darryl:
Exactly. So it's all relative. Right. Like, good marketing isn't expensive. It's an investment that pays off when it's done right. And a solid strategy can bring in ways, way more revenue than it costs.

René:
100%.

Darryl:
Yeah. Which means you start seeing more customers, which means more profit. And you can talk with the marketing team down the road and figure out, I would love to add hoodies and hats. Are we at a point where we should be doing that? Because we do have a little extra cash because of your marketing. You brought in a hell of a lot more customers. Can we do that now? Rene does it.

René:
Yes, we can.

Darryl:
We didn't do it right out of the gate because it didn't make sense. Or maybe you're saving money for future endeavors. Maybe that's what the marketing does. It builds your capital. Or maybe it's rolling back into marketing on another level. Right. I get really passionate about this and I'm sorry, I sound like I'm like, I'm worked up, I'm fired up.

René:
Don't apologize, dude, proof is in the pudding, man. Telling you I'm your poster child.

Darryl:
Yeah, well, I talk to people all the time about this. They're small businesses, they're really trying. They have a great product or they have a great service. And I see it and I will give them advice. I'm like, here's some things you have to do. And they're like, okay, that sounds great. And then they're like, let me add 25,000 hats to my shelf that I don't need. Let me add, you know, a sandwich maker in the back, which you don't need at this moment.

Darryl:
What we need is to tell people you're great and you're not doing that yet. And one thing I can't stress enough is DIY marketers think marketing is 100% social media based. Now I understand it's 2025. Social media is a giant piece of the pie. There's other pieces of that puzzle that need to fall into place that are outside of social media. People actually need to physically touch your product. They need to see you, they need to see your product, they need to see you in other spaces.

René:
100% agree.

Darryl:
Yeah, it gets lost. So at the end of the day, transitioning from DIY marketing to professional help is about knowing your limits and understanding your business needs. Some people get lucky, I won't deny that. And they can keep doing their own marketing forever. But usually with that, they cap themselves. There's a ceiling and they likely will never break through it. Yes, they're making good money, but they're probably not going to make any more.

René:
I get lucky from time to time.

Darryl:
That's what Meghan says.

René:
Yeah, well, I wasn't talking about my marketing either.

Darryl:
So like I was saying, those people will never break that ceiling, but others need to hand it off before they lose their minds or their business. It happens so often where we see a great product or a great business or a great service and you're like, oh my God, that's going to be great. And then they disappear.

René:
I remember in the early days of our planning when we were starting to develop, you know, our brand and our marketing strategy and my old business partner be like, oh, that's stupid. Or that's not important. Like, I'm going to follow my gut and I'm going to listen to Darryl on this one.

Darryl:
And where is he today? Dead. If you've watched Freaks and Geeks, he's not dead. That's a Freaks and Geeks quote. I'm sorry.

René:
And he's a solid dude.

Darryl:
So if you're constantly frustrated, overwhelmed, or just not seeing results, it might be time to bring in the pros. Whether it's hiring someone for small tasks like I said, or giving them the whole strategy, the key is making sure your marketing is actually working for you. Stop draining your time, stop draining your energy. It's so simple. Okay, here's your challenge. Take an honest look at your marketing efforts this week. Are you crushing it or are you drowning? And if it's the latter, maybe it's time to call in the reinforcements.

René:
Very few. Because I pay attention to marketing all the time. Very few times have I ever seen do it yourselfers crush it.

Darryl:
I agree.

René:
Just putting it out there.

Darryl:
All right, that's it for me. Go make some decisions. And for the love of God, never, ever use Comic Sans ever again.

René:
I thought you were going to say never, ever use condoms again. It's like, where is he going with this?

Darryl:
We'll be right back.

Darryl:
So what are you talking about today?

René:
I want to educate you guys on how transferring assets from one institution to another works. Like the behind the scenes stuff, because people don't understand how that works. And it's not to say that it's intricate, but I think it's more important than we realize. And the process is very archaic. So I just want to go through, you know, if you're looking, let's say you were looking at working with our firm and you had all of your money at the TD.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Well, there's a process there for us to go and get those assets and let's talk about it.

Darryl:
You know, I just want to bring this up before we even get started is I had some stuff with Scotiabank long ago and I told you, we had a conversation and you said, you know, move that over. And so we did. But you would not allow me to go into Scotiabank and say, I'm out, bitches. Yeah, you told me not to do that. I think it's so wrong. It should be part of the process.

René:
I wanted you to be a little more tactful. Well, that's a good point. Let's start with that. When you make a decision to transfer your assets and you've had a long standing relationship with your advisor, if that's the case, a courtesy call or an email or text or something, or like you say, a visit in the office to say, listen, you know, I've made a decision, I'm moving my stuff. And you know, it's been great working with you. It's classy, yes, it's tasteful. But if your advisor's an ass, then you can go in there branch, then.

Darryl:
You can do the bitches thing.

René:
Yeah. The process is often different depending on the type of investment or the type of product you have.

Darryl:
Okay.

René:
Whether it's an rsp, TFSA or non registered, typically the receiving institution will send a transfer document to the relinquishing institution to let them know that we're transferring it so that it maintains, let's say it's an RSP so that it maintains RSP status so there's no tax implications. So that is, first and foremost, very important. If you're moving over $1 million RSP portfolio, you want to make sure that there's no tax implications.

Darryl:
No kidding.

René:
But what's interesting in this day and age, Darryl, is that we're still in the stone age when it comes to this process, is that we like physically fax a transfer document to the TD.

Darryl:
Oh my God.

René:
The fax document goes to the transfer department, and then it takes them like six to eight weeks to get us the money. And then they physically mail a check.

Darryl:
It's insane, yet we're sending billionaires to space for a little joyride.

René:
It's insane. It's absolutely insane.

Darryl:
It's insane.

René:
There are a handful of processes now that are wire transfers. Like, we've seen it done as quickly as two days. So maybe there's a small shift in evolution in this space, but it's turtles, man. Slow moving. So we fax some accept emails, which is nice because then you have proof that the email was received. Because with faxes, even though you have a fax confirmation, it doesn't mean they got it. They'll easily say at the other end, well, we didn't get it. And that happens all the time.

René:
It's such a painful process for my team and I to actually go through this because we in fact have a dedicated person on our team. We call them follow ups. So they do follow ups on transfers all the time to make sure that they happen in a timely fashion. So if an advisor or even a bank that doesn't have the resources to do that, it takes forever to get this shit done.

Darryl:
It's so fresh.

René:
It's really, really painful. And that's why I want to talk about it, because, you know, it's nice to set the expectation when a client decides to do this that, you know it's not going to happen tomorrow.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Because we often have clients messaging us like two weeks later saying, I'm still seeing my RSP account at Scotia or at TD or whatever. Why hasn't it moved? It's because they're just not getting to it. Like, we'll call them after three weeks. So we have a reminder. So let's say you transfer your million dollar RSP account from the td, we move it over. We don't even set a reminder to follow three weeks later because we know TD won't move on it that fast.

Darryl:
That's crazy.

René:
Yeah, it's insane.

Darryl:
I have a friend who works for a bank in Toronto and you had told me this long ago about the faxes and I had asked her this question, is it true? Like, you guys get faxes and like, what do you do with them? Like, is it instant you grab it off the machine? And she said, there are coworkers of hers, the fax will come in, they will see it. And she's like. And they just leave it. And I said, why do they leave it? She's like, because that's not their job to carry it from one office to another. So sometimes it'll literally sit on that fax machine for days.

René:
How do you like them apples?

Darryl:
Which is crazy to me.

René:
I know a lot of it is automated now too, where the fax comes in and it doesn't actually print. The fax, it'll go to.

Darryl:
Goes to an email. Yeah.

René:
It goes to a queue, right?

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
But I don't know. It's so flawed.

Darryl:
No kidding.

René:
So anyway, the client sometimes feels frustrated with this and we feel helpless. But at the same time, we're also the face of this whole transaction. Because if we're requesting the transfer come over automatically, it's our fault, Right. We're too slow at doing it or we did something wrong or whatever. But it's at the other end. We're at the mercy of this transfer process.

Darryl:
So.

René:
And so often the relinquishing institution will actually just say we didn't receive it. And what's even gotten worse since the pandemic is that most institutions don't even answer their phones anymore and they don't have a voicemail. So it just rings and rings and rings. So, like, Raman from our team will call TD like three times in a day to try to get through to make sure that Darryl's RSP transfer is happening.

Darryl:
That's insane.

René:
And when she finally gets through, they're like, oh, we never got the fax. So then we have to re-fax it and then follow up again a few days later make sure they got the fax. And then we set a reminder in three weeks because if we haven't received the money in three weeks, we start calling them to hound them. We have stuff that are outstanding for three months right now. And we've had stuff outstanding for as long as six months. This one case at CIBC dude, it's a registered product and it's still outstanding and it's been six months. So we've contacted their ombudsman and the ombudsman is just saying, oh, well, you know, it takes time. So even the governing body that's supposed to monitor and enforce processes are saying, I don't give a fuck.

René:
So like it's so, so frustrating to deal with this behind the scenes thing that it's very problematic. We typically don't talk a lot about, you know, the behind the scenes stuff of what we do, but this one here is, it's a doozy.

Darryl:
It's frustrating to see that the people at the bank are driving a Land Rover when they should be driving a Fred Flintstone car.

René:
Yeah, yeah, that's right. You know, yes, it's really, really thick soles on their feet. So the other thing is being very clear on what you want to transfer, right? So let's say you have a Nvidia stock that you're a big fan of and the rest of your portfolio is either stocks or bonds or, you know, a mutual fund portfolio or whatever. And you decide you want to keep just that one Nvidia stock. Well, you have to be very, very clear with your advisor that you're wanting to keep that intact. Because let's say from a non registered perspective and you have a huge capital gain, you want to make sure there's no disposition on that, right? Because even if you were to move it over in cash and just repurchase it, well, there's a disposition. You could be stuck with that capital gains tax. So you either decide to leave it with the current institution or you request it in kind.

René:
So the next step is, well, do you move assets in kind or in cash? And that could happen in any account. It could be an rsp, a lira, tfsa, non registered, you name it is that in kind means that if you own a basket of goods, doesn't matter what it is, whether it's GICs, mutual funds, bonds, stocks, you name it. You move that basket of goods intact, and essentially you just take it. We just plunk it into our shell account so the underlying investment don't change.

Darryl:
Oh, okay.

René:
So let's say it's an RBC global equity fund that you really like and you don't want to give it up, we just move it over in kind.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
The advantage to that is that if it does take six weeks in transit, then you stay invested for those six weeks.

Darryl:
Okay.

René:
Because whether it's with the RBC or it's with us, you're still maintaining the same underlying assets. So we have the ability to go get, say, an rbc, even if they're RBC mutual funds, because we're licensed with everyone in Canada.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
We'd move that basket of goods over to our firm, and then we take a look at how we're going to make changes and recommendations to the portfolio, and then we do it all internally so that there's no time out of the market.

Darryl:
Yeah, yeah.

René:
The other option is in cash. So people will often say, you know, I don't want to move this in cash, it's in an rsp, or I don't want to move it in cash, it's in my tfsa, and I don't want to deregister my tfsa. What what in cash means doesn't mean you're turning your TFSA or RSP into cash and having the tax implications. What that means is you're moving the account in cash rather than the basket of goods. So you sell off the stock that you have. You sell the mutual funds that you own in the portfolio, it's liquidated in cash inside the rsp, and then they mail us a check.

Darryl:
Okay, gotcha.

René:
Instead of moving the basket of goods in kind and just bring it over to our shell account and keeping everything intact, you're then moving it in cash. So you know, the risk then on the flip side is moving everything in cash could be problematic if there's a huge increase in the market. Right. Where you may lose out on some possible growth in your portfolio if you're out of the markets for four to six weeks while this whole process is in transit. Right.

Darryl:
No kidding.

René:
So on the flip side, though, it's not our job to play God and start trying to time the market, but in the off chance that the markets were to drop, it could be a saviour as well, too.

Darryl:
Yeah, true.

René:
Right. So if you move that RSP account out at the RBC and it's two, three weeks out of the markets, and the markets tank. It's impossible for us to tell. So whenever possible, what we do is we move the assets over in kind. We take it over, and then that way, it protects the client from this unknown time delay for getting these transfers done. So there's no real perfect answer or solution to get this done, but we try very, very hard to make this as seamless as possible. But you got to remember, we're at the mercy of everybody else that we're working with. Right.

René:
So the relinquishing institution really holds the cards, unfortunately.

Darryl:
Well, and it's such a relevant topic because. Well, not just because of our podcast and educating people on the importance of a Certified Financial Planner, but at the same time, I feel like our society has really grown and people are really investing these days, as opposed to how they used to say 20, 30 years ago. And when you go. I know friends who are like, oh, I know you told me to call René, but the guy down the road, I saw him at a grocery store, and I decided to start working with them. And then six months later, like, hey, that guy's a douche. So how do I move my shit to Rene? Right. And then I feel it's more relevant and happens more often where you kind of just jump on that first offer because you're like, oh, this sounds great. They sound like they know what they're talking about, and then you realize they don't.

Darryl:
And moving it is so relevant today.

René:
So now you're dealing with two transfers. The guy at the grocery store probably took over your investments from somewhere else.

Darryl:
True.

René:
If you were a do it yourselfer and you were on Wellsimple and you transferred it from wealth simple to Scotia, and then six months later, you realize the Scotia guy's not even there anymore because he moved on to pizza delivery or something.

Darryl:
Yeah. If you haven't heard that episode, you got to go back to it.

René:
Yeah. And then you're transferring it again, you know, six months later to our firm. So.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Yeah. It's a process.

Darryl:
Yeah. And disclaimer. It's important to find the right person.

René:
Absolutely. And to not do this too too often unless. Unless necessary. So then the next thing I said, I wouldn't talk about taxes, but then the tax implications. So going back to bringing it in kind versus in cash is. Let's say you have, like, a corporate portfolio with 2,3 million bucks in it, and you've had this portfolio for some time, and you. You may have upwards of a million to a million and a half in capital gains taxes to pay. So you want to make sure, like what we would do in that case is that we would bring it in kind and we would manage it and then we would decide or we would come up with a strategy on how to, you know, most effectively pay these taxes maybe over a number of years to get into the right portfolio that we've recommended to improve their investment habits.

Darryl:
Right, gotcha.

René:
So rather than just pull the $3 million in cash and just say, well we're going to pay the million dollar capital gains tax on it this year, we bring it over in kind and then we come up with a strategy to be as tax efficient as possible. Having said that, if you're working with a ding dong that doesn't know what he's doing, that could be very, very problematic and could cost you a lot of money. We actually ran into a case just in the past week where the client, because of, you know, the, the volatility we're seeing in the markets with our good friend south of the border, Donald Trump, he said I just want to transfer it out in cash and I want to make some changes to my portfolio to kind of protect my legacy. But there would have been like an eight or eight hundred fifty thousand dollar capital gain that we had to deal with. So I was like whoa, whoa, put the brakes on. But at the other end the other advisor was just about ready to press the red button like he was going to detonate a friggin nuclear bomb. It's like no, no, don't, do not do that.

Darryl:
That's a lot of Benjamins.

René:
Yes.

Darryl:
Oh my goodness.

René:
So transferring assets could really implicate some tax problems that you want to make sure that you're making some very informed decisions on how you're going to move this money.

Darryl:
Yeah, no kidding.

René:
So we have the ability, in fact, not us, we're not special, but that the industry has the ability to move non registered assets in kind as well too so that you can move it in kind and then just be very strategic about how you're going to pay the tax on it as you shift your investments around.

Darryl:
It's all strategy.

René:
It's all strategy. That's why you got to work with someone who knows what they're doing and that has the skill and qualifications to be able to steer you. Right. It's way more important than people realize.

Darryl:
No kidding.

René:
And then lastly we talked about doing this multiple times is the fees. Some banks, trust companies, credit unions, investment firms don't have fees. But I would say 75 or 80% of them do. And I remember in the old days of early 2000s would be like $25 fee, $50 fee. And even then I thought, holy, man, that's crazy. Like they charge you the management fees to manage your portfolio all these years and they still kick you in the nuts when you leave, right?

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
But now like one of the most expensive ones is RBC, actually is $150 per account plus HST. So imagine if you have an RSP and your spouse has an RSP and you each have a TFSA and you each have a locked in account and possibly a joint non registered account and you're young enough to still have an resp. Oh, and your kid has a disability, has special needs and qualifies for the registered disability savings plan. So. Oh, now you're at nine accounts. So transferring nine accounts at 150 bucks plus HST, it adds up. So you know, you do that once a year because you're switching banks or whatever and you're just kind of chasing the flavor of the week.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Could chew away at a big chunk of your return depending on how much money you have.

Darryl:
No kidding.

René:
I once saw a case at the td. So this woman was a nurse, and at RSP season she would just do some preliminary tax stuff and just dump $150 into a GIC RSP account at the TD. So she had like five RSP accounts that were GICs that were all coming due at $150 plus a little bit of interest. And the TD was charging her $50 to transfer it out. So she was going to lose a third of every certificate.

Darryl:
Oh my God.

René:
I physically walked into the bank. I'm like, this is highway robbery, guys. This is like a license to print money. So I finally convinced the bank manager to combine all of her GICs into one RSP account so there would be one transfer fee. But otherwise, if no one would have questioned that, this poor woman would have lost a third of her investment in transfer fees.

Darryl:
That's crazy.

René:
Stupid. So stupid. But anyway, things people don't pay attention to and don't realize. And sometimes it's not until it's too late because the transfer happens whether you know about it or not. There's supposed to be disclosure, but very few people talk about it. So you get your final statement where it shows the account balance is zero because the money's been transferred to the other institution and you see your $150 fee. Well, by then it's too late.

Darryl:
Yeah. Who Are you going to call? You can't call anybody and bitch about it. They're not going to do anything.

René:
We can't even call to get the money transferred.

Darryl:
Yeah, right. You pick up the phone.

René:
You think someone's going to give a shit about your $150 fee? No one gives a shit. It's crazy. We live in a world and no one gives a shit.

Darryl:
That's insane.

René:
Mediocrity is acceptable and no one's accountable for anything. Yeah, sometimes to that point. Like let's say you had a TFSA account. So TFSAs are non taxable. Of course, they track your contribution limit in that. But if, let's say you only had $10,000 in a TFSA account, it might make sense to cash in the TFSA and repurchase it, say with us. Because if you cash in your TFSA account, you redeem the whole amount and you have them put it back in your bank account. There's no fee.

René:
Yeah, because it's not a transfer.

Darryl:
Yes, I gothch you.

René:
It's a surrender. So if you're surrendering your investment, then you can turn around and repurchase it. And of course you get all of your TFSA room. The only time that becomes a problem is if you're maxing it out. So if the limit this year is 102,000, but you've grown your portfolio to 202,000 and you have $100,000 gain in there, you don't want to cash in the 202,000, you're only going to get the 102 room back.

Darryl:
Yeah, no kidding.

René:
So you just want to make sure that you're strategic about that. But there are little loopholes from time to time when you get lucky that, you know, we get to save those fees. But. But it's a topic in our industry that we don't speak of very much.

Darryl:
Yeah, I call it a shit show. A shit show.

René:
It's a shit show that I felt was important. You guys learned a little bit more about no kidding. Yourself included. Because it's funny, of all the conversations we've had, we've never really talked about this. Yeah, that's it for me, man. I don't want to stretch this topic out too much, but these are some important items that I just wanted to shed some light on.

Darryl:
When I retire, if you want to hire me part time to walk into banks and be like, pick up the fax, you bitches. I'll do it. We'll be right back.

Darryl:
I've said bitches a lot this episode. I don't feel like I'm cranky, but...

René:
You got anger issues

René:
I don't know. I don't know. I just. When we talk about the banks, I get worked up. Good thing I don't work in finance because my stress level would be through the roof talking about banks all the time.

René:
I hate to sound like I'm shitting on the banks, but you know what? They often deserve it. You know, just little stuff. Like, again this week, I ran into this poor lady who was making like $32,000 a year and she'd been saving in her RSP. And why is the bank recommending an RSP savings account anyway? Like, you don't need the tax deduction. You're in a 20% tax bracket. And when you retire, you're going to be in a 20% tax bracket. Even more beneficial, you do the TFSA. So when you draw from that in retirement, you're not going to have the taxable income that the RSP will create, and then you'll have a greater chance of qualifying for the Old Age Security supplement.

René:
Like, there's no advice there. It's just to just kind of roll with it. You know, we spoke in an episode one day where it's like we have a bunch of doctor's office with people walking around with white coats, but no one are really doctors. Just call themselves doctors.

Darryl:
All right. You brought this up to me the other day, and it's a topic that I think is so relevant for most people, and that's happiness.

René:
Yeah, man. That is a choice, in my opinion. I'm glad we're talking about this.

Darryl:
Well, we're sitting in 2025, and whether it's turning on the TV and listening to politics, no matter what side of the aisle you're on or you're at the grocery store dealing with some douchebag, or it's at work or it's at home, it seems like more times often than not, we're chasing after happiness.

René:
Perfect example this morning. I always make coffee at home because I like to think I make the best coffee in town.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
But every once in a while, I just want to feel treated like somebody made me a coffee. So I'm going through the drive through this morning, and it Was a bit of a wait and the server says, oh, I'm really, really sorry about the wait. Which led me to believe that the person in front of them was bitching about how long it took and just decided to be cranky and bitchy. Like a Karen, right? Yeah, like to worry about a dude. I sit here, I got my heated seats on, I'm listening to some good tunes, like, don't worry about it, it's all good, man. And it just totally changes mood.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
It's like a conscious decision to just say, am I going to get fucking frustrated because this is taking more time than I would expect or am I just going to chill and just roll with it?

Darryl:
That's the thing. There are people who can find reasons to complain even if they won the fucking lottery.

René:
Absolutely. And that's what I wanted to talk about is the conscious decision of just being happy. Right.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Having the right mindset to just say, I'm going to be happy today. One thing Meghan and I say every day now, I don't know, I saw this on friggin Instagram, like I don' six months ago or something.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
One of the first things I say to my wife in the morning, I'll say, good morning, give her a kiss, ask her how she slept, the usual. And I'll say, hun, today is the first day of the rest of our lives. Let's make it a good one. Because it's that fucking simple.

Darryl:
100%. I think a lot of people think happiness is something they'll achieve one day. Which I think that's where the mindset shift comes in. Right.

René:
100%.

Darryl:
Like people will think when they have more money or when they lose weight or when they get the perfect job or when they finally take that dream vacation. But I think, think the reality is that if you're miserable now, you're probably still going to be miserable sitting in that chair in Bora Bora.

René:
Absolutely. I've asked people, I'm like, why are you not pinching yourself right now? You have like the best life ever.

Darryl:
No kidding.

René:
Like, you have a great career, your business is killing it and you love doing it. And you got a loving family. You're so tight to your family, drive a beautiful vehicle, you're healthy, you're in good shape. Everything, everything's going right for you. Why the are you not like over the moon?

Darryl:
Well, and that's the thing. Happiness isn't about where you are, what you have. It's about how you think. It's that choice you make daily. Like you said, when you wake up and you say that to your wife, you can choose to focus on what's wrong or you can focus on what's good. Even the small stuff like the fact that coffee exists or that your dog thinks you're a fucking superhero for coming home every day. Those things are amazing to think about.

René:
I know, I know. And believe me, I'm not perfect. I choose to be happy. But there's days where I let life get to me and I get grumpy and I like. I don't like myself when I'm grumpy. I don't like being miserable or unhappy. I gotta shake this.

Darryl:
Yeah, Right.

René:
So then you just gotta, like. It's almost like a reset button, whatever it is, Getting a good night's sleep or a workout or just. You know what? I've been practicing mindfulness more these days just to kind of reset. Happiness doesn't happen on its own. You just gotta make a decision that you're going to be happy with your life. And for me, what I've observed is that happy people are more successful.

Darryl:
Yes.

René:
Right. So you create that snowball effect of happiness, is that the happier you are, better things are going to get like. It just makes for a better life. Just be happy!.

Darryl:
When you brought this topic up and said we should talk about happiness on the podcast, I started to think about it and I'm like, okay, yeah, I'm the same as you. I'm not perfect. There's a lot of things I'm happy about. And then there's some days where I'm just in a pissy mood and I started to think about why is that? And I'm like, your brain is a jerk, right? Like, everyone's brain is a fucking drama, a queen at some point, and it's wired to focus on negative things. And I think the reason why is. And this sounds crazy, but back in caveman days, that helped us survive.

René:
Oh, maybe. Maybe it was a defense mechanism.

Darryl:
Right? The whole, oh, look, a beautiful sunset wasn't useful in the caveman days. It was like, oh, look, a saber toothed tiger is about to eat me. That was more important. Right. But in modern life, that negativity bias just makes us overthink. It makes us stress. And I'm guilty of this. It makes me spiral.

René:
So when you're sailing into the sunset is because you were trying to keep the saber tooth tight.

Darryl:
That's right.

René:
That's where that comes from.

Darryl:
I like to give hacks of things that I do. And so here's one that I've been working on for myself because I'd say In the last 10 years, I've been really trying to focus on bringing happiness more into my life than negativity. And the one thing I do is try to train your brain to focus on what's working. And what I mean by that is, every day, write down, like, it could be a scrap piece of paper. It can be in your phone, whatever. Write down three things that went well, even if it's small. Like, my coffee didn't taste like shit today, right? Do it enough and your brain starts looking for the good stuff on its own. It's like muscle memory.

Darryl:
It's like working out.

René:
Amen. You should never drink the coffee that tastes like shit, by the way. It should taste like coffee beans.

Darryl:
I know, I know.

René:
That's not good.

Darryl:
The other thing is to start to understand that some of these things are out of your control, like traffic, weather, your neighbor's weird habit of mowing his lawn at 6am That's a thing in my neighborhood, by the way.

René:
That's a good one.

Darryl:
But your reaction to these things, that's all you. You ever notice how some people can go through absolute chaos and still crack a joke while others lose their minds completely over, like a minor inconvenience?

René:
Yeah.

Darryl:
100% like, that difference isn't luck, it's perspective. If you want to be happier, still start asking, is it worth ruining my day over? If the answer is no, move on.

René:
That's a big, big one. Is the stuff that's not in your control. Don't get worked up about them. I know whether you stress about them or you get angry and cranky about them, it's not going to change the outcome. So just stay happy. It's going to be easier to navigate those problems or those frustrating moments.

Darryl:
Something you taught me a long time ago is misery loves company.

René:
Yeah, that's like. That's why I was going to stop hanging around with you when I said that.

Darryl:
Well, that's the thing. Whether it's friends or social media or news, it's going to rub off on you. And I'm not saying you need to cut people out of your life completely unless they truly suck. But you do need to be mindful. And you've taught me this. Who and what influences your mood? Spend more time with people who lift you up and make you laugh and remind you that life isn't a series of inconveniences.

René:
No, there's people that I like very much that I just stay away from. Because it just, I notice it. You walk into a room, it's like, oh my God. It's exhausting, the negativity.

Darryl:
Yeah. We have a couple and they're good friends, we love them. But I can't. There are days where I'm like, I can't be around this guy because it's, it's just complaining.

René:
I know we sometimes. But it's part of the podcast we're trying to educate.

Darryl:
Well, that's the thing. It's entertainment.

René:
Some of the frustrating things about our work and the industries we're in, but, ah, to talk about that day in and day out is so, so fucking draining.

Darryl:
I don't think happiness is about pretending life is perfect. I think it's more about choosing to focus on what's good. Like I said, training your brain to stop obsessing over, like, the negative and realizing that your mindset is kind of the bigger factor in how you perceive your life. Right.

René:
I've seen people that are dying of cancer that have like a better attitude than people that have everything going for them and, and are ultra wealthy.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Just because you're wealthy doesn't mean you're happy. No, you have to have a happy mindset.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
So there, there were three things I wanted to bring up. One of them you stole from me.

Darryl:
Oh, I'm sorry, I stole it. I bet you that didn't make you happy.

René:
You ding dong. Yeah. So three things for me that helped me make a just a conscious decision to choose happiness is being mindful of the little things. Right. Instead of having this big focus on the end prize, like you said earlier is like, man, like I woke up this morning. I don't know, at the age that we're at, I don't know if you ever get these moments, but sometimes I wake up and it's like my heart is just pumping at the right pace and it's just like I'm breathing easy and I feel like I had a good night's sleep and I feel super healthy and I'm like, this is the best feeling ever. Like, that is a recipe for happiness is just recognizing the little moments that life is good.

Darryl:
I thought you were gonna say at our age, when you wake up and you're like, whoa, I did wake up.

René:
I did wake up.

Darryl:
I do get those moments. Oh shit, I'm still here.

René:
And, and another thing that, that you touched on was another important point of mine is it's not about the, that you have have and the success that you're experiencing that should determine your happiness. Because, like, I know this person in my life who has not a pot to piss in. Right. Can barely afford a little beater car.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
But has so, so much joy for life and is so outgoing and is so happy. Like, I remember giving her a piece of furniture and she was just so over the moon. And in fact, she took the furniture apart and repurposed the wood to build a shelf that was more appropriate for the space that she lived in.

Darryl:
Amazing.

René:
And was over the moon that I had done this. Like, happiness is not a reflection of how much money you make, what car you drive, where you live. Like, the other thing for me is simplicity. Sometimes you got to take shit out of the equation for happiness. Right. And even physically, I'm a minimalist when it comes to my office space, when it comes to my living space, even in my car is like, I don't like having shit laying around. I don't like visual clutter. Visual clutter is stressful for me.

René:
One of the happiest times of my life, and I've said this before in prior episodes, was when we lived in that little shitbox apartment. 850 square feet. It was a beautiful little place, but it was not friggin fancy. It was like click flooring and it was laminate countertops and.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
But minimalism just made me so happy because I had no clutter, I had very little responsibility. I had no stress. Right. There's no financial stress of mortgages, there's nothing. It's like, yeah, life is good, man. I get to do this all over again tomorrow. This is perfect.

Darryl:
Love it.

René:
Happiness is a choice. And. And you know what? And if you're not happy, make changes, man. Yeah, make changes. If you're in a terrible relationship, get out of it. Yeah, I know it's tough to make that leap. People are creatures of habits and it's like, o, oh, we've been together for 30 years. And if you're really not happy, work at it.

Darryl:
Yeah, try, right?

René:
Because relationships are work.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
And relationships are worth working on because they're important. But if you're truly that unhappy or work, like, how many times have we prevented people from walking off a cliff and helped them make a career change because they hated their lives and public admin or whatever, and went into private practice, whatever the story may be, if you hate what you're doing being, you hate the life that you're living, it could be all in your head and you make a conscious decision to make some changes and just be happy.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
But if you need to make changes to be happy, then you make those changes because you could be dead tomorrow.

Darryl:
Yeah. You know, I love giving our listeners a challenge, so I want to do that here, too for the next week. Every time you catch yourself focusing on something negative, I want you to reframe it. Like, find one good thing in the situation, like, you're stuck in traffic or, like, in the drive through, like you said, and you're like, you know what? I'm glad I'm stuck in traffic. I needed some extra time to think about my summer vacation plans. Whatever it is. If you do that enough, I promise you'll start seeing happiness in places that you've never noticed before. All right, that's it for us today.

Darryl:
Go out there, be happy. Or at least try. As always, if you're enjoying the show, hit the follow button or leave us a review wherever you're listening to this podcast right now, stalk us on Instagram for more chaos. Spread the word about our show. Happiness is contagious, and so is this podcast.

René:
Keep searching for happiness.

Darryl:
We'll see you next time.