Navigating Capital Gains Changes and Family, Friends and Marketing

Darryl [00:00:00]:
So many people don't know this about our first season, but we recorded a bulk of our episodes in your home office in Kelowna, overlooking the mountains.

René [00:00:10]:
Yeah, and what a good time it was too.

Darryl [00:00:13]:
That was amazing.

René [00:00:14]:
Little known fact.

Darryl [00:00:15]:
Yeah. Now we're in season two. I haven't been back, which hurts my feelings. And you're there recording the last episode and this one too, which I feel is a little unfair. Like, I'm looking at you right now online. I can see your beautiful background, which is fucking mountains. And what do I have to look at? I got my office here. This is not fair.

Darryl [00:00:37]:
What inspiration do I have to record this podcast?

René [00:00:40]:
Me. Here's looking at you, babe.

Darryl [00:00:42]:
Whatever. Enjoy hiking in the mountains with bears, bobcats and coyotes.

René [00:00:47]:
Yeah, actually, we were out walking the trails behind our house two days ago and the lady says, yeah, watch out. She says there's been a lot of coyote sightings here lately.

Darryl [00:00:58]:
Oh, so for real? Guess watch out!

Darryl [00:01:01]:
I guess my office isn't looking so bad then.

René [00:01:03]:
You're a little safe in Toronto.

Darryl [00:01:04]:
Hold on a sec. Did you only invite me to BC because you knew I'd be the slow one on hikes? Was I just your bait? This is Taming the Hustle...

René [00:01:21]:
Or something of the sorts!

René [00:01:39]:
Alright, my good buddy, what are we talking about today?

Darryl [00:01:41]:
Okay, I know I talk a lot.

René [00:01:44]:
Everybody knows that.

Darryl [00:01:44]:
There's no denying that. So maybe today is the day that I'm gonna give you a break a bit. And I think I have a bit of a shorter topic.

René [00:01:52]:
Okay.

Darryl [00:01:52]:
At least I think.

René [00:01:53]:
Let's see. Maybe I'm going to have a lot of questions today. Who knows?

Darryl [00:01:57]:
This is true, but I want to touch on a topic that's near and dear to my heart and can make or break the heart of a business owner, and that's leveraging the power of family and friends in our marketing efforts.

René [00:02:09]:
What do you mean by that?

Darryl [00:02:10]:
Well, to put it simply, family and friends generally don't share your business content.

René [00:02:16]:
Yes, that is true.

Darryl [00:02:18]:
Makes me so angry. I find it interesting that sometimes the people closest to us, our family and friends. Be the toughest to crack when it comes to supporting your business. Right. And as business owners, we pour our fucking heart and souls into our marketing content. But often the likes, comments and shares from the inner circle are really few and far between. But I get this question come up frequently. No matter what I do, my family and friends don't like my posts, share my content.

Darryl [00:02:44]:
Nothing. Fucking crickets.

René [00:02:45]:
No comments, nothing. Right. That's the engagement that makes a world of difference when you're in business. But what's the psychology behind that? It's got to be a reason, because it's not just you and it's not just me. I've talked to other clients about this

Darryl [00:02:57]:
100%. Well, I think there are a few reasons. First, our loved ones might be hesitant, and it might simply just be a jealousy thing, which I hear often.

René [00:03:05]:
Okay.

Darryl [00:03:05]:
And whether that's true or not, who knows? I don't know the psychology behind that, but I do believe that could come into play. Someone who has the nine to five job that they don't love, that they sit at a desk, they don't have a window they hate. They hear stories of you as a business owner going out and, oh, my God. Yeah, I visited a guy in Kelowna today. Right. It's like that whole jealousy thing. But it might really just be that they're hesitant to flood their own social media feeds with what they perceive as business stuff.

René [00:03:35]:
Yeah, I don't know, because it comes up for discussion a lot more often than you would realize with our business clients.

Darryl [00:03:40]:
Oh, I believe it. I think it's like they worry about alienating their own networks. Right. It kind of like dilutes their own personal page. But I think the real issue is that there's often a lack of understanding of how crucial that engagement is for business owners.

René [00:03:54]:
Yeah.

Darryl [00:03:54]:
And what I mean by that is how important it is for mom, dad, your sister, your cousin, your best friend, whoever, to engage by liking, commenting, or sharing your content. So today I want to talk to those of you who know business owners, but business owners, you need to listen up too, because this is important. So whether your family or friends are simply just an acquaintance, the most important point I can make is that the support of family and friends can truly make or break a business. And I said that a minute ago, and I truly believe that every person matters in your business. Stranger, family, friend. But your family and friends, their engagement just doesn't boost your ego. Yeah, it feels nice. And I've had this before where a family member has said when I've asked them, how come you don't like my stuff? And they're like, you just want to get your numbers up to boost your ego.

Darryl [00:04:38]:
And I'm like, no, it's not that. If you like my stuff, there's a whole world that opens up that could affect my bottom line.

René [00:04:44]:
Yeah, you can help me make money.

Darryl [00:04:45]:
Yeah. So when Aunt sue shares your latest blog post, or cousin Mike likes your Instagram photo. They're not just doing it to be kind, they're actually helping you reach a new audience.

René [00:04:54]:
Yeah, absolutely.

Darryl [00:04:55]:
And helps you kind of build that credibility and ultimately drive sales.

René [00:04:58]:
Yeah, just helps you with exposure, man. It's like, that's what social media is all about when it comes to the proper marketing.

Darryl [00:05:03]:
Oh, and it sounds so simple, right? It's like to get someone, you know, to click a like button, to click that little fucking heart on Instagram or share your poster story.

René [00:05:11]:
Which is kind of funny since we started this podcast. Uh, marketing comes up in conversation a lot more like, I'm supposed to know what I'm talking about.

Darryl [00:05:18]:
Yeah, same with finance.

René [00:05:21]:
Oh, yeah, there you go. You giving financial planning advice yet? So it is funny. It's like, man, like, I'm not getting any likes and comments from, like, the ones that are closest to me that you expect to be the first ones to click that like, button and to make a comment and to share. Right?

Darryl [00:05:36]:
Yeah, that's the thing. Let me break down a little further. For those of you listening who know business owners of why that one little click really does matter.

René [00:05:44]:
It would be interesting to hear the psychology behind that as well too, because there's got to be a reason for it.

Darryl [00:05:49]:
There has to be. There has to. Again, is it jealousy? Is it laziness? I just don't know.

René [00:05:54]:
We will have to bring the right expert to ask those questions, if that expert even exists.

Darryl [00:05:59]:
Yeah, 100%. But when you simply share or like a post of a business, you know that one click now becomes visible to your network of friends or family, many of which who don't know about this business already. So you click that like button on the post right now, someone who follows you is scrolling through their feedback 5 hours later and that post pops up in their feed now at random. And it is kind of random because all these social media platforms make it really hard to get to people. But when you click that, like...

René [00:06:29]:
Oh... It gets to you though.

Darryl [00:06:31]:
It gets to me. It sure does. So why does this help? Well, this increases visibility for that business that can lead to more people visiting their social media page or their website or physical store or business. And those are people who likely aren't following that business already. Like I just said, the more visits someone gets on social media means more potential customers that see that product or service. And you know this, everyone knows this. Just one new customer making a purchase increases revenue, obviously, but can just open up a world. And that trickle effect of one person could turn into two, to turn into five, to ten, to 20 customers.

Darryl [00:07:09]:
It's so important. So if you like that post and one of your followers sees it and begins to follow that business, and then they like a post later on, that cycle continues. Now it hits their circle of social media friends. So every like and share or comment isn't just a click, it's a potential step towards a sale. So when I say this, for the love God, just click the fucking like button.

René [00:07:32]:
Like it. Like it a lot. How do we change this? How do we. How do we get our friends and family to engage in our social media lives to help grow our business? If only you had the answer, right?

Darryl [00:07:41]:
Yeah, if only had the answer. I got. I got two hamsters spinning on the wheel upstairs and boy, one's going one way, one's going the other way. It isn't working. No, but I. I get this question often. So I always tell people you have to encourage, like, more support from your nearest and dearest, and it's about communicating and making it easy for them to support your brand. What I often tell clients is that sometimes you need to consider having a heart to heart with family and friends about why their support actually means the world to you.

Darryl [00:08:09]:
And I know it sounds silly, but it's almost like an intervention with your family and friends where you can explain that if they click that like button, it opens up to more potential customers without them actually having to say, hey, everyone, look at my friend's business over here. Right?

René [00:08:24]:
You can put it on your Christmas wish list and say, this year, don't get me anything.

Darryl [00:08:28]:
Yeah, just like my post.

René [00:08:29]:
Just like all my posts. And be interactive as much as you can. It's free, takes very little time, and it's going to help me a lot more than that toaster you were going to buy me.

Darryl [00:08:39]:
That's a great idea. That's. That should be a Christmas card.

René [00:08:42]:
Yeah. What do I want for my birthday?

Darryl [00:08:44]:
You know, but all you need from them is that one click. Right? But here's the thing, you need to make it easy for them. So always provide clear calls to action. And I say this with everything, but in your caption, right click the like button if you agree or if you want to see more or whatever it is, have shareable content. And, you know, I bitch about this all the time. The nicer your content is, the more likely they're going to want to click that like button. And maybe. And here's a, here's one that it's a little controversial.

Darryl [00:09:13]:
And I've had clients disagree with this, but have a little incentive, sweeten the deal for them. And it might help, like give family and friends discounts or a gift. If they somehow refer someone to you. It could be as simple as giving a gift card for a free coffee. And like I said, I, business owners disagree with rewarding family or friends to get new business. But here's the thing. It's a two way street. So if you show your appreciation for their support, it's.

Darryl [00:09:36]:
It's gonna come back. Right.

René [00:09:38]:
Right. That makes a lot of sense.

Darryl [00:09:39]:
And you need to engage in their content. So. That's right. That picture of Uncle Bob on his fishing boat, you need to click the like button, too.

René [00:09:46]:
Oh, there you go. That I agree with. You have to be engaging. And it's a two way street. You can't just take, take.

Darryl [00:09:52]:
Yeah. You have to respect their boundaries. Right. You can't ask for something and not give something in return.

René [00:09:57]:
Absolutely.

Darryl [00:09:58]:
So if you know a business owner, I am begging you. Begging. I'm on my knees right now.

René [00:10:03]:
It's not pretty.

Darryl [00:10:04]:
It's not pretty. At the very, very least, like their content. Click that little heart on their posts, their stories, their reels, whatever. Just click the damn heart. And if you really want to take it a step further, make a comment on their post or share it to your feed or your stories, and you don't even have to write anything. If you're on their post and you click share to your story, you don't have to write anything. Just send it out into the world. People who see it don't need a description.

Darryl [00:10:27]:
If they see something that intrigues them, they'll click on it. And that's all we're asking as business owners.

René [00:10:32]:
Yeah, it goes a long way, for sure.

Darryl [00:10:33]:
Yeah. All right. That's it. The power of family and friends in our marketing efforts is so important. Don't underestimate the impact of those closest to you and the impact they can have on your business. Reach out, show some love. Have the intervention with your family and friends and say, please, just like my stuff. And watch your marketing efforts soar.

René [00:10:51]:
It can move mountains.

Darryl [00:10:52]:
You and those goddamn mountains. We'll be right back.

René [00:10:58]:
Well, that was your best non-content content, Darryl.

Darryl [00:11:14]:
Yeah, non-content content.

René [00:11:17]:
It's true. There wasn't a whole pile of facts and strategies there. But it's so important to bring that up because like, it's a pretty common topic of conversation with business owners and it's important to have that support with friends and family, and it makes the world of difference. And we appreciate you very much. So thank you for your support.

Darryl [00:11:35]:
It's a tough game out there. And yeah, exactly what you just said.

René [00:11:38]:
Not gonna get any easier either.

Darryl [00:11:39]:
No. Social media and the powers that be have made it so hard for you to get your content out there. And you could hashtag keyword and try to put hooks on your captions. But if a family or friend likes your post, that's the easiest route to get in front of somebody else.

René [00:11:56]:
Well said, mister marketing guru.

Darryl [00:11:57]:
Thanks. It feels like pulling teeth sometimes. And speaking of which, you're talking about some new tax changes that are just about as painful as pulling teeth.

René [00:12:07]:
I'm talking about the recent changes that have been proposed with the 2024 budget about the increase of the inclusion rate for capital gains tax.

Darryl [00:12:16]:
Capital gains tax. Capital gains tax is, I feel my biggest fear in life, aside from family and friends not liking my content.

René [00:12:25]:
So dry my lips are sticking together. A lot of people are talking about it. That's for sure.

Darryl [00:12:29]:
For sure.

René [00:12:30]:
So let me explain. Capital gains tax. And you know it'd be more applicable to some than others.

Darryl [00:12:34]:
Yes.

René [00:12:35]:
Essentially, the three main ways to pay tax on is interest income, right? So let's say that's rental, or you're earning interest on a GIC, or you're earning interest in your bank account. So that's pretty much the same. Like, that'll be on a T5, and you'll have to report that as if it were salaried income, essentially. So if you earn 10,000 of rental income or interest income, you have to add that to your income. Dividends have some preferential tax treatment, which we won't talk about today as well, which is a little bit better than interest income. And then you have the capital gains tax, which is the most effective way of paying tax. So the capital gains tax works like this.

René [00:13:08]:
If you have a triplex and it's worth a million dollars and you've had it for a number of years and you paid $200,000 for it.

Darryl [00:13:15]:
Yeah.

René [00:13:15]:
So now you have an $800,000 capital gains to pay on the sale of that. That duplex or triplex. Currently the inclusion rate is 50%.

Darryl [00:13:25]:
Okay.

René [00:13:26]:
Which means that you'll have to add 400,000 to your income. Okay. So if you own that with your spouse or a partner or whatever, you'll have to declare half of that. They'll share the tax consequences. Well, let's assume, just for illustration sake, that you own this on your own.

Darryl [00:13:40]:
Okay.

René [00:13:41]:
So now you have to add 400,000 to your income, plus whatever other sources of income you had for that year. So you could potentially pay, you know, 54% tax on that.

Darryl [00:13:49]:
No kidding.

René [00:13:50]:
So your million dollar triplex, with an adjusted cost base, the ACB, of 200,000, which is your purchase price.

Darryl [00:13:56]:
Yeah.

René [00:13:57]:
You now have a gain of 800,000, which you have to declare 400,000 to your income, which means that you, at the highest marginal tax rate of 53.53%, you'd have to pay almost 215,000 in income tax.

Darryl [00:14:10]:
Ouch.

René [00:14:11]:
So you're losing 21, 22% of the sale price.

Darryl [00:14:14]:
I know you said in a previous episode just recently that paying tax is an obligation, and owing tax is what you should want to do, but when you owe that much, that hurts.

René [00:14:25]:
It's a kick in the balls. So now the new rules that they're looking at implementing, which would be effective June 25, 2024. So any sale made on the 25th or any time after that, you would have to, if owned personally, you would have the 50% inclusion rate on the first 250,000, and then the difference would be taxed at 66 and two thirds.

Darryl [00:14:48]:
Oh, wow.

René [00:14:48]:
You'd have to include two thirds of the capital gains in income instead of just 50%. So, just a quick math on that. The same triplex, you would end up paying about $263,000 in income. So that's nearly $50,000 more in income tax.

Darryl [00:15:02]:
Yeah, no kidding.

René [00:15:03]:
So if you're selling a property that's 5 million, well, now you're paying a boatload more money. Right? Another 250,000.

Darryl [00:15:09]:
Oh, wow.

René [00:15:10]:
So that could be real significant. Let's take a step back for a minute and kind of dissect this. This inclusion rate. So they kind of juggled the idea of implementing a capital gains tax in the sixties, but it wasn't until 1972 that it was actually introduced.

Darryl [00:15:24]:
Okay.

René [00:15:24]:
And at that time, the inclusion rate was 50%. So they. They said, okay, you're going to have to include 50% of your capital gains on a sale of a property. So that could include, like, shares of a company, could include real estate, you know, your mutual fund portfolio that's non registered, a sale of your business, like, you name it, cottage. That's a huge deal, right? You inherit the family cottage, and all of a sudden, even though you haven't sold it. You have a disposition. Got to pay a boatload of taxes.

René [00:15:50]:
Like, it could get pretty complicated. And very expensive as well, too.

Darryl [00:15:53]:
No kidding. Easy to make mistakes.

René [00:15:55]:
Yeah. So then in 1988, they increased it to the two thirds, like we're seeing now. And then back in 1990, they actually increased it to 75%.

Darryl [00:16:05]:
Oh, wow.

René [00:16:05]:
And, yeah, that's very significant. So then in 2000, they dropped it in February to two thirds again, and by October of 2000, they had reduced it to 50% again. So since 2000, the inclusion rate's been 50%, like it was originally introduced in 1972.

Darryl [00:16:20]:
Yeah.

René [00:16:20]:
Now we're seeing it come back up again. So the word on the street is that this is like a stepping stone. This two thirds inclusion rate is a stepping stone for them to bring it back to the 75% inclusion rate, which is where they'd like to be. Of course. It's a lot more government revenue. Right.

Darryl [00:16:35]:
Yeah, no kidding.

René [00:16:36]:
So then you would pay significantly more tax, because on that million dollars, you would have to include 75% of the $800,000 gain. So now, all of a sudden, you're paying a fucking boatload of taxes.

Darryl [00:16:47]:
No kidding.

René [00:16:48]:
So a couple of things that you have to keep in mind with the proposed changes is that for corporations and trusts, so let's say that Triplex was in your holding company. You had set up like a real estate corp. The inclusion rate of two thirds is on the first dollar.

Darryl [00:17:03]:
Okay.

René [00:17:04]:
Okay. And same thing with trusts. But personally, the first 250,000 remains at 50% inclusion, and anything above 250 is then taxed two thirds.

Darryl [00:17:15]:
Okay.

René [00:17:15]:
So what could help you say, particularly for an individual who has a cottage, is make sure that you keep all of your receipts for capital improvements. Right. Because if you build an addition or you raise that cottage to put a new foundation or you completely redo your kitchen, you should keep all of those receipts and have evidence that you spent that money making those capital improvements, because that cottage that you would have bought for 200,000 if you spent another 300,000 on it. Now, your adjusted cost basis, five. So you only have to pay the tax between the million dollar sale and the $500,000 ACB. So keeping all of your receipts and logging evidence of the renovations you've done, you've brought contractors in whatever could significantly reduce the capital gains tax. So even if it's something that you don't foresee ever selling and just passing on to your children at death through your will, your estate will still be responsible for that disposition. So increasing the adjusted cost base will help lower the amount of tax that you have to report as a capital gain.

René [00:18:20]:
So a lot of people come to me and say, like, oh, fuck, I can't believe I got so much fucking tax to pay. But had they known, had they been given advice from day one when they bought the place to make sure that they recorded all of those expenditures, they could have increased the adjusted cost base, therefore lowering the amount of tax that they have to declare for capital.

Darryl [00:18:38]:
How many people come to you with this problem with a cottage, and you say, give me all your receipts. And you start going through those receipts and it's like speedboats. Oh, yeah. Jet skis. And you're like, no, no, dumbass. That increases your....

René [00:18:54]:
Yeah, capital improvement.! But when I do mention that, I would say, without exaggerating, like, 95% of people, don't even think of that. There's 5% of people that will keep those receipts and evidence of the cost of the improvements. So it's something to be noted.

Darryl [00:19:12]:
Yeah. Like, for. For my cottage, that. That whole room with the stripper pole and the bar.

René [00:19:20]:
That is a capital improvement.

Darryl [00:19:20]:
Yeah, exactly.

René [00:19:20]:
Yeah. And then for corporations, I would say it's probably less of an issue because typically when you're incorporated, you have an accountant that, you know, prepares your financial statements, does your income taxes. So they would be depreciating whatever they can with those capital improvements, and they would be tracking all of that year after year. So you'd have a record of it that you've actually done this with the government, and you'd have this on your books.

René [00:19:42]:
It's usually for the individual that doesn't really track this. And I would say the most common one is just like a family cottage.

Darryl [00:19:48]:
Yeah. Yeah.

René [00:19:49]:
And the other would be if you had a rental unit of some sort. So you're not this big real estate guru, but you've got a duplex next to your house or somewhere down the street that you're renting out, and you just thought that would be a good source of passive income. Make sure that you log all of that stuff properly because it could save you a boatload of money when you come to sell.

Darryl [00:20:06]:
And I'm going to say this, and I know I said it before, and I'm going to say it again, and I know it makes you uncomfortable for me to say this, but you are a certified financial planner. This is what you do. And I had this conversation with a friend of mine who recently retired, and he had this very niche company that took them all over the world, made a really wealthy living for himself, but he sold his business. And originally he had the thought of gifting the building to the new owner because he paid 150,000 for it, like 40 years ago. And he was worried about the capital gains tax. So, of course, my question to him was if he worked with a certified financial planner. And he said, I do, but not for something like this.

Darryl [00:20:45]:
My CFP is more about investments. Then he tells me he sold the building for 10 million. And his exact words were, "And I was right. The damn capital gains killed me." And I was shocked. And I gave him shit and said, this is why you should have been working with René, because he could have saved you a boatload on those taxes. So my point here is, for the love of God, work with the CFP. That encompasses all your financial planning needs.

René [00:21:10]:
Yeah, holistic financial planning, man. Leave no stone unturned.

Darryl [00:21:14]:
Yes. I don't understand it. So get. If you have to deal with this, get your ducks in a row. Have someone behind you who knows what the hell they're doing.

René [00:21:22]:
You need to find me more of those clients that are willing to give away $10 million properties. Darryl, I can't come up often.

Darryl [00:21:27]:
I know. I wish I wouldn't have known. He could have gave it to me.

René [00:21:30]:
That can't be something that happens very often.

Darryl [00:21:33]:
No kidding.

René [00:21:34]:
Did he have dementia?

Darryl [00:21:35]:
No. No.

René [00:21:36]:
You would think I could have called him daddy. Thanks, dad.

Darryl [00:21:40]:
I've been trying to. He just. He won't adopt me. Well, listen, if you have, like, again, saying it again. #callRene. He knows his shit. If it's not René, at least use somebody. Don't do it yourself.

René [00:21:53]:
If it's not René. #textRyan.

Darryl [00:21:55]:
That's marketing right here. Let's play an ad. Maybe they'll listen.

René [00:21:59]:
Let's take a break.

Darryl [00:22:00]:
We'll be right back.

Darryl [00:22:16]:
So I want to chat today about something I know thats super important to both of us, and thats the power of volunteering and giving back to our communities. But I'm going to put a little bit of a twist on things.

René [00:22:29]:
I don't like it when you do twist, bud.

Darryl [00:22:31]:
Let's twist again like we did last summer.

René [00:22:33]:
I like to think I can wing it, but I much prefer being prepared.

Darryl [00:22:36]:
I know you do. But you know, we live in a time where the world often feels divided and fast paced. And the act of selflessness, like offering our time and skills or resources, can profoundly change not only those in need, but I think, for ourselves as well. Like, we all know why volunteering is important, right? It bridges gaps, fosters that empathy, builds a stronger and more connected society. And it doesn't matter if you're mentoring youth like I've done through hockey in the past, or like how recently you and your team created this clean up the town event or helping at local shelters, or, like, every act of kindness contributes to this kind of ripple effect of positivity. And we all know this, and you know as well as our listeners by now that I talk about mental health a lot and things like how to better yourself, whether it's sleep or exercise or connecting with friends. But I want to talk about the importance of how volunteering can help you. And we're not experts, but over time, I know that volunteering or giving back has had a profound effect on my well being and personal growth.

Darryl [00:23:35]:
Engaging in those acts of kindness, it boosts that whole endorphin type thing, you know, that brain's natural, feel good chemicals.

René [00:23:42]:
Absolutely.

Darryl [00:23:43]:
So, I kind of want to put you on the spot here.

René [00:23:46]:
hmmm.

Darryl [00:23:47]:
I'm sorry. I know I didn't really give you any info about this topic, but your cleanup, the town event, was a huge success. It was so good for the town. We saw the town rejuvenated. Everyone got excited about getting together, having this big cleanup party, and it was great. But here's my question to you. How did that event impact your life or the lives of your team?

René [00:24:08]:
Well, you know, what resonated with me when we had John Gilmour on was what he became really passionate about was how he saw the person giving and how he observed how good it made them feel about giving.

Darryl [00:24:23]:
Exactly.

René [00:24:23]:
So it was not so much the recipient, whether it was the foundation or an individual or the organization or whatever the cause was, but the person that was giving and how good it made them feel. Right. And I think that's an act of selflessness. And like I've mentioned before in the program, is that you get so much more out of life by giving than receiving. Right. Like I found from observation with the people that I've been surrounded with throughout my life and career, is that the givers are a lot happier than the takers.

Darryl [00:24:53]:
Yeah, 100%.

René [00:24:54]:
Right. There's nourishment there.

Darryl [00:24:56]:
Yeah.

René [00:24:56]:
There's this butterflies of good feelings in the pit of your stomach, knowing you're doing the right thing. So, this particular event is no different. We're involved at many levels in our community. We're involved with our families. And, you know, giving is something that should be done selflessly. Yeah, this particular event was interesting because we saw, I would say about 100 people show up, you know, in our tiny little community.

Darryl [00:25:23]:
No kidding.

René [00:25:23]:
And I've had conversations with our team about this since. And there was a couple of things that really resonated was that we were becoming the voice of something that many of our citizens wanted, is they wanted to change the mindset of Kirkland Lake that we're not, you know, we don't have to be this dirty mining town that we can be, you know, like a Huntsville or a Collingwood where we're cleaner and we have pride and we have self esteem. And we want to have a cleaner community to attract more professionals. And I'm also on the physician recruitment committees where we're trying to, you know, step up our game to be more attractive to professionals so that they come to Kirkland Lake not only as locals, but actually bring their family up and move here and set up practice. Right. So the feeling of that was the ripple effect. Is that okay, you know, it's one cleanup day, but it was way more impactful than that. Our purpose is that let's carry that on as a lifestyle and as a conscious decision to, you know, keep our properties clean and to sweep our sidewalks and pick up our dog poop and just make the community more attractive to professionals, to families to come live here.

René [00:26:36]:
And we had an astounding amount of people step up and say, this is exactly what we want. But no one was communicating that to anybody. Right? So if we can stay on this and have a lasting effect, that is very powerful and that is a very, very feel good moment. The other thing that stood out in the crowd with my team and I is that. But Kirkland Lake has always been a revolving door to immigration, right. With mine towns. It happens. Like my best bud is.

René [00:27:08]:
Sorry, Darryl. One of my best.

Darryl [00:27:10]:
You better say one of your best buds.

René [00:27:11]:
One of my best buds. First the mountains, now under a nobody.

Darryl [00:27:15]:
So lucky you are 4000 km away.

René [00:27:20]:
Well, one of my good friends is in his mid eighties now and came to Kirkland Lake as an Italian, not speaking any English when he was 18 years old to work in the mining industry. And you know Joe quite well.

Darryl [00:27:32]:
Yes.

René [00:27:33]:
Joe is not an immigrant anymore. Right? He's a Kirkland laker.

Darryl [00:27:37]:
Yeah, 100%.

René [00:27:38]:
Right. And we've seen this time and time again with, you know, the polish community, with Ukrainians and this is going back, you know, decades, is that now we're seeing this again with a variety of immigrants in our community. And we had recently done an art gallery and a fundraiser called 'Our Neighbors' to. To kind of highlight the importance of integration and how important immigration is for our community, because it is the livelihood of Kirkland Lake. But the first people and the largest number of participants that day were the new Canadians that have established themselves in Kirkland Lake. And it was so powerful. Like, I remember I got a glance of Ryan, and I could. He's like, I could tell that he was thinking what I was thinking.

René [00:28:26]:
It was hair raising to see. There was joy, there was cultural diversity, there was families. People were just showing up with their aunts and uncles, with their siblings, with their kids, and it was a true community event, right, that brought people together who don't fucking know each other at all but are all like minded in this tiny little community who want to better the place that they live, right? So we were just the driving force. We didn't actually make this happen because the participants showed up and cleaned up. But the voice was loud and clear, that everyone was like minded and wanted a better community. I'm not dissing Kirkland Lake. Kirkland Lake is my home, and I love KL.

Darryl [00:29:09]:
Yeah.

René [00:29:09]:
It's a great place to raise a family. You have freedom when it comes to living in the north and having lots of space, lots of green space.

Darryl [00:29:17]:
No kidding.

René [00:29:17]:
It's such a strong knit community. People always tend to come together, but there's just that missing piece of attracting new business and attracting professionals and making the community more appealing. Right. So instead of putting lipstick on a pig, we just want to slim up the pig a little bit.

Darryl [00:29:38]:
Yeah. Yeah.

René [00:29:39]:
And it seemed like everyone participating was of the same voice, and it was really magical to see so much cultural diversity and to see the New Kirkland Lakers were the first ones to show up and step up their game. So I can't speak for the team, but the way it made me feel was that, you know, it was worth it, because it was. You know, there's a few times I was like, ah, this is a pain. You know, like, seems like a lot of work for, like, are we. Are we going to really reap the benefits as a community by doing this? But, again, we were very transparent that this wasn't just a one day event, that we wanted to turn this into a mindset and really try to drive change in the community. And I think that although it's baby steps, I think that we had a pretty big impact, and it's a really good feeling.

Darryl [00:30:27]:
Well, when I said that, like, you know, when I talk about mental health and stuff like that, I find volunteering and giving back really helps with that. And I think you proved that in kind of what you just said. And, you know, that releasing of those endorphins that, you know, got you excited about this, you and your team, when you had this event planned, you had it planned during, literally the end of tax season, like, one week left, which is literally your busiest time of the year. And, you know, stress, I'm sure, in your office is at a high, and anxiety is probably at a high because there's so many, you know, check marks to check off. But here's the thing. You did that the day before the event. You were stressed. You had lots on your plate.

Darryl [00:31:11]:
You know, I had questions for you because I, you know, we help you market the event, and it was quick conversations. I gotta go. I have this. I have that. Lots on the go. And then once the event happened and I talked to you that night, it's like that stress and anxiety literally just went away. It all of a sudden kind of like, hit your reset button, and it provided that sense of purpose or fulfillment or whatever, and I think puts things into perspective, right, and gives you that kind of positive outlook on life that no matter all the shit that's going on in your life, when you do something good for others or, you know, or get together with your community to do something good, it just boosts that mood. And all of a sudden, you feel like there's a sense of purpose and you're not alone.

Darryl [00:31:56]:
And no matter how much work there is to do, you still have people backing you, right? But for some people, it's that whole feel good. And, you know, the positivity can bring stuff out for you, but it, for other people, it can be just perspective. And I want to give you a quick example of a friend of mine who I had worked with in the film industry before. They had kids, him and his spouse. They were totally the type of, like, keeping up with the Joneses. It's like, I got to buy the best car. I got to have BMW. I have to have a four bedroom house.

Darryl [00:32:27]:
And it was all. I have to have everything the greatest and never really appreciated anything they had. Anytime they had something great and some be like, wow, that's really nice. Like, yeah, but something new just came out, and they'd want that new thing. And then they started volunteering at a local shelter. I don't know what made them volunteer, but they did. And I saw this giant shift in them, and they were starting to have children, and all of a sudden, their perspective just shifted completely from, you know, keeping up with the Joneses to all of a sudden being grateful for what they had, like, their home and security. And it really shifted how they, I think, raised their kids, because their mindset before used to be going for that money, money, money, money, and never really appreciating those little things.

Darryl [00:33:13]:
But then when they started volunteering, they started to understand the value of the dollar and the appreciation for all these good things and how one day it could all be there and the next day it could be gone because they were meeting people who literally had, you know, $100,000 jobs, a four bedroom house, who are now in this shelter, and now they're raising their kids to appreciate the stuff. Like, this stuff isn't just given to you. You have to appreciate and understand that it can be taken away from you. And so I think that perspective can sometimes help you. Maybe it's not a mental state or a mental health thing, but it's, if you get stuck in that rut, it can help you in that sense, too. And, like, another thing is the interacting with diverse people can really help you understand the different life experiences you talked about, people coming from Ukraine or wherever. It really broadens your horizon and strengthens your, you know, social connections. When you understand the life that other people have had or barriers that they have to overcome, I think really contributes to the benefit of enriching your own life and kind of creating that cycle of positivity or growth.

René [00:34:16]:
Like, there's really nothing wrong with having nice things. But it really shouldn't be your only driving force, and it shouldn't identify who you are as a person.

Darryl [00:34:24]:
Exactly.

René [00:34:25]:
Like, there's nothing more nourishing in life for me, you know, to meet new people and to develop real quality relationships.

Darryl [00:34:32]:
Yeah, for sure.

René [00:34:33]:
You know, if money's all taken away, you know, you still have a lot of wealth, in my opinion, if you've nourished those relationships. Right. But if you spend your whole life alone chasing the bucks, I mean, you could be left very, very lonely. So there is. There's definitely some feel good moments when you give your time. But you have to do it with authenticity.

Darryl [00:34:52]:
Exactly.

René [00:34:52]:
You have to do it selflessly. And, you know, selflessness should be tried more often. Yeah, I think we would live in a better place if people were a little more selfless.

Darryl [00:35:00]:
Exactly. Like, no act of kindness is too small.

René [00:35:03]:
Well, that's another thing. It's funny that was just brewing in my mind is that I listened to a podcast at one point and they said, well, you know, you don't.

Darryl [00:35:11]:
Was it our podcast?

René [00:35:13]:
Yeah. It wasn't this one? No, we've never spoke of this one before.

Darryl [00:35:16]:
Just checking.

René [00:35:16]:
They said, you don't have to be like a Bill Gates billion dollar philanthropist to make a difference. Right? And you don't have to wait until you have a pile of shit to offer.

Darryl [00:35:26]:
No, just do what feels right.

René [00:35:28]:
Give your time. Get involved where you're passionate, because it'll make things a lot easier for you as well, too. If you're going to participate in volunteer work that you're passionate about, it's going to make your participation a lot easier and you're probably going to get more involved and you'll probably make a more significant impact.

Darryl [00:35:43]:
Yeah. Every effort counts towards building a better world.

René [00:35:45]:
I agree. Good topic.

Darryl [00:35:47]:
I know you're tired of hearing me talk, so part of my giving back is saying goodbye.

René [00:35:53]:
Thank you. Best gift of the day. You're so selfless.

Darryl [00:35:57]:
Thanks for joining us and we'll see you guys next time.

René [00:36:00]:
Ciao.