The Graduated Tax System and The Value of Creative Professionals

Darryl:
They say you learn from your mistakes. And the other day, I learned firsthand how one simple elevator button can open up a door to a world full of surprises.

René:
Oh, you did, did you?

Darryl:
I did. I was heading to a meeting the other day in this office building in Toronto, and I jumped on this packed elevator and I hit the wrong button. Stupid me. I hit the 45th floor, not the 46th, and obviously I didn't notice. So we get to the 45th floor, and the elevator dings, and everyone looks at me like, this is your floor, dude. You're the only one who pushed this button.

René:
You're the loser.

Darryl:
I am the loser. So instead of admitting I'm a dumbass. No. I confidently walk out of this elevator thinking once the door is closed, I'm gonna push the button and I'll catch the next one. Right. Except it didn't work out that way.

René:
My guess is the same elevator reopened.

Darryl:
No, thank goodness. Actually, maybe that would have been better. No, this office building. The elevator doors open right into the reception area.

René:
Yeah, yeah, I've seen that before.

Darryl:
Yeah. And as soon as I walk out, I'm greeted by this very kind receptionist who immediately says, hello, how can I help you? So I look at the sign on the wall.

René:
And it says, sperm donor clinic.

Darryl:
If it had been, maybe I might have stayed a bit. No, the company was a therapy center for addictions.

René:
Nice.

Darryl:
So, like, I kind of laughed it off and said, no, no, no. I accidentally got off on the wrong floor. And her voice goes into the soft, caring mode and she's like, sure you did. You're in a safe place here. So I tried to explain that I pushed the wrong button, but by now she has me by the arm, leading me to sit down into one of these comfy chairs. And she's like, no, you pushed the right button.

René:
That would have been funny.

Darryl:
I guess. Anyway, my next appointment's Thursday. This is Taming the Hustle

René:
or something of the sorts.

Darryl:
Yeah, so I made a new friend with the receptionist. She does not believe me. She thinks I have a bad addiction to something that I'm not willing to admit.

René:
I have an addiction to secretaries.

Darryl:
No, if she was like a math or a french teacher, then we're in.

René:
Yeah. Oh, yeah. That's right. That's right. I forgot.

René:
Hey, what are we talking about today?

René:
Something so, so, so interesting you're gonna just freak out.

Darryl:
Hold on, hold on. Should I put it on a seatbelt? Yeah.

René:
We're gonna talk about taxes today.

Darryl:
Oh, taxes. Some reason my ass just puckered up.

René:
Yeah. What I find very, very common with people that we chat with is that the tax system in Canada is largely misunderstood.

Darryl:
No kidding.

René:
You know, even people that do their own taxes on turbotax or whatever software they might buy online is, they just don't understand. You just punch in numbers and, you know, squeeze tafe fest and hope for the best.

Darryl:
I know people like that.

René:
And it's not that complicated, but it is, I guess.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
But I want to kind of demystify a few things. I know we've kind of talked about this a couple of times in different episodes and just kind of in passing, but there's a few things that I want to talk about for people to understand, you know? So, first of all, in Canada, and please note that it's going to change slightly from province to province.

René:
So I'm going to talk about the province of Ontario only because Ontario is the largest province in Canada. But all provinces, of course, except Quebec, is very similar. So Quebec has a different set of rules. So when you're filing your tax return, it's actually a combined tax return. It's federal and provincial, and you're filing both at once. Whereas in Quebec, you physically have to file two separate tax returns, you have to file the federal one, and then you have to file the Quebec tax return. Beautiful province of Quebec, very european, lovely culture. But they make it a commitment to be different and difficult.

Darryl:
Two stamps.

René:
Two stamps, yeah, that's right. Well, hopefully you're e filing and getting things done a little more quickly and killing list trees. So let's use the province of Ontario. So, first of all, your personal exemption amount. So that's federal as well. So the amounts vary slightly from province to province. But in 2024, as an example, your personal exemption amount is $15,705. So that means that you get to earn almost $16,000.

René:
Let's use $16,000 just for simplicity.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
So you get to earn the first 16,000 of income tax free.

Darryl:
Okay. Okay.

René:
And then you move to the first tax bracket. So the first tax bracket after the 16,000 to about $52,000 in income is 20% tax. So you're paying 20% tax on that first tax rate.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
So if we pause there for a second, the first thing I wanna bring up is the eligible dependent. Everyone seems to think that, you know, they have five kids, they can have five dependents and have whole bunch of income tax free and all of that stuff. It doesn't work that way. If you have a spouse that earns no income, and I've mentioned this before, if there was a year that Erin, let's say she was laid off and her EI ran out and she had income for a particular year, well, then you can use her personal exemption amount of $16,000. So then essentially the first $32,000 that you earn is tax free.

Darryl:
Oh, I see. Okay.

René:
So when you're declaring an eligible dependent, it means that you're declaring your spouse as an eligible dependent and you're using her personal exemption amount as well.

Darryl:
Oh, she's a dependent alright.

René:
Yeah, she's a pain, not a dependent.

Darryl:
Oh, yeah. Yeah.

René:
So if your spouse is earning income, however, you no longer have the ability to use an eligible dependent deduction.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
But let's say you're divorced.

Darryl:
Okay.

René:
And you're single, like legit single. Not living with a woman who has a kid, and you have a life together, and you decide to cheat the system if you're legit single.

Darryl:
So like, single single?

René:
Like single single.

Darryl:
Hold on. Let me. Let me close my eyes and think about that for a second. No kids, no wife.

René:
Your eyes are really closed. That's dreamy. Here's where it gets real, though. You still have kids.

Darryl:
Oh, okay.

René:
Fml. So then if you're legit single and you have dependent children, so you have a child that you're caring for and lives with you, you can use that child as your eligible dependent and claim their personal exemption amount.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
So now you can still earn the first $32,000 of earned income before you pay any tax.

Darryl:
Makes sense.

René:
But if you have a spouse that's earning income, you can't try to play the system and try to claim a child as an eligible dependent because now both spouses are working. Yeah, understood.

Darryl:
I get it. Okay.

René:
So now that's the eligible dependent deduction. Then once you reach the $52,000, you start slowly moving. And I'm not going to go through every tax bracket like verbal diarrhea all the way up to the highest marginal tax rate. But just keep in mind that there's different rates where you get increments of taxes that you're paying at a higher level.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
Then the second thing that I find is very misunderstood is let's say you're moving to the next tax bracket. That's kind of significant. So let's say $56,000. So your tax bracket from $56,000 to 90 is 30%, 29.65, to be precise. So people that are earning $55,000 will say well, I don't want to earn more than the 56 because then I'm going to be subject to a 30% tax bracket on all my income. Just because you're bumped to the next tax bracket, it doesn't mean you're going to pay 30% tax on all of your income. It's just income above $56,000.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
So you're paying that tax bracket in different increments. So then moving all the way up where you have, say, $175,000 in income, then you're bumped up to 48% tax bracket. And furthermore, if you're earning more than $247,000, your highest marginal tax bracket in Ontario, which is federal and provincial combined, is 53.53.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
So you're essentially getting to keep 46% of your income, but that's only anything above $247,000. Okay, so again, to demystify is that just because you're earning $275,000, it doesn't mean you're paying 54% tax on all of your income for the first dollar. The first $16,000 is tax free, your personal exemption amount. And then you're paying 20% tax, and then you bump up.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
Until you get to $247k. And then at $247k, you pay 54% tax.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
So then the next thing that I hear all the time, dude, is, oh, I'm not gonna work any overtime. I'm just gonna give it all to the government.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
So you mean to tell me you're going in for an overtime shift and you're already making $150,000 a year and you're gonna do it for free? Like, come on, man, give your fucking head a shake.

Darryl:
I've seen people literally pull out a calculator when being offered a raise, understanding that they are going to jump up the next tax bracket. They hit equal and they're like, well, it makes no sense for you to give me that raise unless you're giving me it to me at a higher level.

René:
So stupid.

Darryl:
I'm paying. I'm going to give it all to the government. Stupid.

René:
So stupid. Like, I'd love to make $10 million a year because I rather keep 46% of something than 100% nothing.

Darryl:
Exactly. Right?

René:
So, like, I tell people that all the time, do you want to keep 46% of something or 100% of nothing? And you're not making 248,000 a year. And if you were, I'd be like, fucking, hey, dude, man, that's awesome.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
Keep working because you're still keeping 46% of it.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
So let's demystify all of this stuff and do a quick recap is understanding the graduated tax system in Canada. It's the same for all provinces, and the income levels vary slightly, but all very similar is that you have your personal exemption amount. You get to declare your spouse's personal exemption amount if he or she has no income. If you are single and have dependent children, you can use their personal exemption amount. And your graduated tax rate doesn't mean that if you get bumped into, say, a 44% tax bracket, that all of your income is going to be taxed at 44. It's only, say, at $112,000 above, you're going to be paying that rate. So there's no disadvantage of making less money. Like, the idea of I'm not going to work more because it's all going to taxes is bullshit.

René:
And I would love to change people's mindset on that because I hear it so regularly, is I won't take that overtime shift because it's all going to taxes. Yeah, I'll take it. I'll take your overtime shift. Just show me what to do.

Darryl:
Exactly. I've seen it with people who are, you know, an employee salary, like I said, refusing to raise because they're worried about being put in the next tax bracket. I've seen it with small business owners where they try to work the system and they're like, yeah, you know what? I stop opening up on Sundays because it puts me in the next tax bracket.

René:
Yeah. Isn't that insane?

Darryl:
It is insane. I'm like, as your marketer, open your fucking doors on Sunday.

René:
Yeah, no kidding. And stay late.

Darryl:
Yeah. Jesus.

René:
So then finally, the last thing, because I know it's a bit of a short topic, but, dude, it's so important to understand this stuff.

Darryl:
Yeah, yeah.

René:
Like, if anyone's interested in seeing these numbers, like, we can share cheat sheets that we've created with you guys. It's. It's not that complicated. But the last piece that I want to talk about is your tax refund. So we do about 700 tax returns a year.

Darryl:
God, you guys are lazy.

René:
Yeah.

Darryl:
Only 700?

René:
Well, actually, this is just, like an added service for the people we work with, essentially.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
And we do some for the public, but for the most part, this is just a value added.

Darryl:
Yeah, for sure.

René:
But anyway, what I hear from people when they have a balance owing is they feel like they got screwed.

Darryl:
Okay.

René:
Like, it's mind boggling. Okay. You have a certain level of income, which means you owe a certain amount of taxes. And if you didn't pay it through payroll, deduction, for example, or if you don't have deductions on your CPP or your teacher's pension, you're going to have to pay it at the end of the year.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
People genuinely feel, Darryl, that they are winning the lottery like it's newfound money when they're getting a refund. The truth is you've paid too much fucking taxes throughout the year. And the most educated and intelligent people feel this way. I don't know what the psychology is behind it, but people that have, like, a $5,000 refund are just jumping for joy. But all they did was fucking pay this in advance to Justin Trudeau, and Justin Trudeau worked with their money all year and made. Made money off of their money. And then on the flip side, somebody gets a bill for taxes owing, and they're like, oh, my God, I owe five grand. I can't fucking believe it.

René:
And they feel like they're getting screwed by the government. No, it's because you did not have enough taxes deducted at source whether you have investment income, which there's never taxes deducted on a T3, a T5, or a capital gain.

Darryl:
Yeah, yeah.

René:
And you have to decide when you apply for your Canada pension and your old age security if you're going to have the government deduct any taxes at source, it's right on the application.

Darryl:
That's funny.

René:
And it's not that you're getting screwed. I actually prefer having to owe money at the end of the year, which means I got to keep my money, or I should apologize. I got to keep the government's money for twelve months and then just give it at the end rather than giving it to them in advance. So I got to work with that working capital for twelve months instead of having to fork it up to Trudeau and Doug Ford. And then finally on that topic is that tax installments becomes an issue. So the rules on tax installments is if you owe more than $3,000 in two of the last three consecutive years, okay, they're going to ask you to pay installments. So actually, for a retired canadian, the sweet spot would be to owe just under $3,000 a year so that you kind of avoid having to forfeit paying your quarterly installments, but that you're keeping as much money in your pocket as possible and having that tax bill at the end of the year.

Darryl:
Gotcha.

René:
So getting a refund is a negative for me.

Darryl:
Like, that is. Yeah, yeah.

René:
I'm like, why would you give your money to the government in advance? For them to do whatever the fuck they want with it.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
Keep it in your pocket and then fork it up at the end of the year, knowing you've kept it all year. Even if you throw it in a, like, Canada life and Manulife have, like, 4.55 and 4.6 daily interest accounts right now because interest rates are so high.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Manulife bank, just. Their bank account is 2.85. So if you owe five or ten grand and you've put it in a 4.6% interest account, you grew some of that money.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Like, if it's 10,000, you get to keep $460.

René:
You know, that's a couple really nice bottles of wine. Or that's half your car insurance for the year or whatever.

Darryl:
Exactly. Yeah. Right.

René:
If you look at it like that. I often tell clients, you know what?

René:
This amount of interest, by just letting it sit there, will pay your car insurance for the year. So instead of, you know, wanting this tax refund and feeling like you won the lottery because it's already your money.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Why don't you keep your money before you have to fork it out to the government and put it in a high interest savings account? And that interest alone will pay for your car insurance for the year. So if you take my advice, you no longer have to pay car insurance. Essentially, yeah. So when you start looking at it like that, it becomes pretty impactful.

Darryl:
No kidding.

René:
But it's really hard to change someone's mindset. And like I said, the most knowledgeable, the most educated, intelligent people will be like, oh, fucking government. They get you every way.

Darryl:
They get you every time.

René:
No, your financial advisor did a great job for you because you got to keep that money all year. Now you just have to cough it up and you have the money to pay it. You're not getting screwed.

Darryl:
Exactly. I find this funny. You've taught me this a long time ago. And because I am not a certified financial planner, I have these conversations with other friends, and it's like talking in circles. They are wearing tinfoil hats because they do not believe what I'm saying.

René:
It fucking riles me up because people just don't want to get it. Oh, fuck. I got screwed. Just can't change that mindset, though. I try really hard. I get through a few people. But you know what.

René:
It is what it is. I guess it's just. It feels like newfound money. It's like forced savings, maybe at 0% interest. I don't know.

Darryl:
It would be nice if they just changed those two words. Amount, owing and refund. If they could change them. To make it sound just a little.

René:
More taxes you didn't pay last year.

Darryl:
Yeah, exactly.

René:
Or taxes you overpaid for last year.

Darryl:
Yeah, write that shit and that gets people excited. It's like, oh, I overpaid? Fucking right. Give me that money back.

René:
We should say something like, by having a $7,000 refund. Justin Trudeau earned $500 in interest last year.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
He says, thank you..

Darryl:
And write it in crayon.

René:
Yeah, purple crayon. With spilt milk on the paper.

Darryl:
That's right. Then everyone would get it.

René:
Oh, my God. It's funny, but it's not. I mean, we have an obligation as Canadians to pay taxes. We live in a wonderful country. We have great infrastructure. As much as we bitch about our healthcare, we have amazing health care compared to other developed countries.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
It's a wonderful place to live. Is our canadian tax dollars spent properly? I don't think they are. I'm with you guys.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
You know, there's a lot of wasted money with politics and politicians, but it's. It's. It's the same everywhere. It is.

Darryl:
It's bullshit. Whatever.

René:
But anyway, our job is to help you pay the least amount of taxes. And you having this big refund is not helping you. And you having a balance owing is not fucking you over. So, hopefully you've learned a couple of things on my rant today, because this gets me real riled up.

Darryl:
Well, I don't call it a rant. I call it a hot take.

René:
Oh! There you go.

Darryl:
We'll be right back.

René:
Passion Chat

Darryl:
So I know you called that a rant. I call it a hot take. What I'm going to talk about today, I don't want you to think I'm ranting, because I'm not.

René:
No, it's going to be a hot take.

Darryl:
It's going to be a hot take. Listen, I want to dive deep into it.

René:
I'm listening.

Darryl:
Yeah, I know. I always tell you to listen. I feel like maybe you don't listen. I talk too much. So I always remind you to listen to me when I think it's an important thing.

René:
Yeah, see, now you're rambling.

Darryl:
I want to dive into a topic that's both pertinent and often overlooked with business. And that's the value of professional services in marketing and advertising. And I'm using that because that is my field. But I say this with every professional service that you use, I see this from both sides of the spectrum, from the business owners and the creative professionals. So you own a business and you want to grow, but you're reluctant to invest in a professional. And I get it.

René:
I'm a grower, not a shower.

Darryl:
That's right. And here's the thing. I could end this topic right here by simply saying you get what you pay for, end of story. Yeah, but I think it's a little more important to know about the why. So let's start with quality over quantity. Yeah.

René:
In my opinion, you can piss away marketing budgets, but if you have the right help, 100%, you've been a game changer in our business. Right.

Darryl:
You don't have to break the bank to have good quality. However, you do have to pay for it. So when it comes to creative services like graphic design, photography, videography, web design, whatever it is, quality should always take precedent over quantity when it comes to your business. Sure, there are plenty of platforms or apps out there offering cheap or even free alternatives, but you need to consider the long term impact on your brand's image. And you and I have talked about this many times. You know, someone starts a business and they're broke or close to it, and they use these free and cheap platforms to kind of get started, which is great.

Darryl:
And I talked about this a few episodes ago about being good at what you do. So you're an expert car mechanic, or you're a dentist, or you're a baker, which means you're not an expert at marketing or advertising or whatever creative service you need. Right? So investing in a professional not only ensures that you have aesthetically pleasing content, but the expertise crafting those visuals that resonates with your audience and conveys your brand's messaging effectively really is so important because here's the thing, a professional looks at everything. So when you design on canva and you put it out there, you're like, oh, you know, I'm going to put a picture of my product, I'm going to put our logo and I'm going to put our phone number. Great. It's out there. But a professional will look at it and when they do it, they see how much written content should there be? There's an actual percentage that people stop looking at your ad. If there's too much text, the psychological effects of color in your industry, what makes people buy, you know, for your industry? People like blues and yellows, but they don't like that for a dentist.

Darryl:
They don't like blue for dentists. I don't know why there is. There's people. And we deal with professionals all the time with the psychological aspects of things. We get these trends. We get these things so we know. You know, for example, like font choice, that could change things huge. You don't know all the fonts.

Darryl:
Image placement. Oh, fuck. This one drives me crazy.

René:
Yeah.

Darryl:
You see? Okay, you got this nice, fancy ad. You got a model, and his hands are cut off at the bottom of the ad, and you're like, you know, I know his hands are cut off, but it looks okay. But guess what your customer sees? They see that model playing with his balls. That's what they see, because they can't see it, right? You're not a professional.

René:
Stupid little stuff. So Ryan and I cracked open a really nice bottle of bourbon that a client brought to us.

Darryl:
Oh, nice.

René:
At the end of a really busy tax day.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
And the client had brought it to us because we had kind of gone above and beyond, you know, what we were doing for their taxes and their tax credits and whatever. So we cracked the bottle open, and Ryan wanted to send the client a nice photo of the bottle. And the two little shot glass that we were sipping on takes a picture of it. It's fucking blurry. They're shadowing, and half the bottle is fucking missing. I said, Ryan, get.

René:
Get the fuck out of here.

René:
I took the picture for him, but the photo speaks a million words, right. And if you don't do it right, you shit the bed and you're wasting your time.

Darryl:
Exactly. That's why I say this is what professionals do. Right? We look at all these aspects. My next point here is understanding the true cost, and that's where this whole conversation comes from. And it's crucial to grasp the real cost behind a professional service. Right. Like, a business owner will bark about the cost of the professional, and then on the flip side, the professional is told that they cost too much. So that bitching goes back and forth.

Darryl:
Well, the initial sticker shock might deter someone hiring a professional. It's essential to recognize that you're not just paying for that final product, just like I mentioned a minute ago. It's the expertise, it's the time, it's the resources invested by these professionals. Like Photoshop, for example. It's a hefty annual subscription to own Photoshop. Those stock videos, stock photos. Although they can be cheapish, the quality ones come at a price. Right.

Darryl:
But lowballing or seeking discounts often undervalues the skills and efforts of these professionals, which really, it potentially compromises the quality of work. Right? So if you charge $100 for your service and someone came to you and said, how's 50? And you decide you're gonna take that job, are you gonna give your best effort?

René:
No, I was gonna say that it's such a deterrent. And when you're trying to lowball that professional, like, we're gonna use marketing. For example, if you try to lowball your marketing consultant, the marketing consultant is going to be less interested in going the extra mile for you because obviously you're demonstrating to them that you're not seeing value in their services. More than ever before this year for non clients that we're doing tax preparation for the non client will come off the street and say, well, do you have senior discounts? Like, well, no, we don't. But I look at their tax slips and their fucking pensioned income as a senior is more than most taxpayers that are in the workplace. So just because you're a senior, you want to pay less because you're not seeing in our services. It makes me just say, you know what? Like, they're obviously not seeing the value in the services we provide. And I feel for you, because what's happening in industry with mainstream social media and access to these cheap apps, everyone thinks they could do it themselves.

René:
It's like getting a good contractor to build a deck. Or you try to do it yourself and you do it half ass and it fucking falls apart. It's like marketing has been a game changer for our business. I would not have been able to do it myself, and I wouldn't be where I am today if it wasn't for a good marketing consultant like yourself. And I'm not just saying that because you're my bud. You fucking revolutionize what we've done with the development and the creation of #callRene, having proper social media, and like you say, like, proper placement, not just the photo, but when to post the photo and what to say and what font to use and who are you talking to? And then you figure out how to post the right message, right? It's like no business owner on the fucking planet, Darryl, has time to figure all that out when you're doing that fucking day in and day out.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
It's impossible.

Darryl:
Well, and that's the thing. It's like when you're negotiating someone's rate, you're negotiating their value. Here's what I want everyone to do for a moment. I want you to think about how much you charge for your service, your product, whatever it is, what your salary is, I don't care. Now you have that number in your head. I want you to cut it in half. Okay? So now that number you have is half the value. Would you work for that same fucking number every day and be happy about it? No, you wouldn't.

Darryl:
So why, when a graphic designer or photographer or whatever it is, when they give you a price and you ask them, can you work for half that cost? Why is it that a business owner is offended when they say no? It boggles my mind.

René:
Photography is another one. I've got clients that are photographers and they try, like people try to undercut them all the time. Like they can just negotiate the value of their services.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
Understand how much fucking work. It's not just taking a picture.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Thousands of, and thousands of dollars of equipment.

Darryl:
Right.

René:
And then hours and hours of editing. I mean, you understand more than anybody.

Darryl:
Yeah. My last point I want to talk about here is the mutual respect you need to have for these people's boundaries and their expertise. Right? So for example, as a creative professional, you know your business better than we do. So as the creative professional, we're going to ask a fuckload of questions to get it right. But on the flip side, when you, the owner, requesting things like endless revisions or expecting favors for free, it not only undermines the professionals time and effort, but it reflects poorly on your understanding of the craft. Like, we've had clients who, and I'm going to give you an example because this one still, we talk about this around the office. We had a client where we wrote a script for an ad and they approved it. We showed them storyboards for the ad before shooting, and they approved it.

Darryl:
We showed them the actor we're going to use. They approved them. They hear the voiceover artists. They approved it.

René:
I know where this is going.

Darryl:
So we go out, we shoot everything, we record the voiceover, we put it all together, and then we show the client and their response is. I think we should change the script. I don't like the messaging. And, you know, while we're doing that, can we find another actor so nice and calmly, I let them know that they approved all this prior to it. They didn't disagree with, they said, no, no, we know. And then I said, okay, great. So just so you know, like, changing all this is pretty much starting from scratch. So the cost of everything is pretty much starting from the beginning.

René:
It's going to be double.

Darryl:
Yeah. And then they lose their shit, and they're like, I'm the client. We agreed on a price, and now you're not delivering on your promise, blah, blah, blah. And we sit there and we're like, we literally asked you for approval all along, but now it's like, now it's on us. We are the bad guy. We're not doing you the favor because you want endless revisions. So instead, always establish that clear communication, positive, constructive feedback. And I.

Darryl:
I can't stress this enough. We've had clients, and it happens in every industry where they make shit up just to be part of the creative process. Could you change that font? It's like, actually, this is the leading font in your industry right now. This actually gets lots of views. Yeah, I think we should go. Can you use this font, which is pretty much almost the same, but slightly different, or, you know, we don't like that green. Can you bring it down a shade by 4%? Right.

René:
Yeah. And it's not to say that the client can't have any say on what his vision, view of his brand is going to be, but you also, if you're hiring someone that you trust, you have to trust that they're bringing their a game and that they're advising for a reason. Right. And what I think is funny, Daryl, is that like, if you were a lawyer.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
And every change that you had to make, the client would pay.

Darryl:
Yeah. 100%.

René:
And no one questions it.

Darryl:
Nope.

René:
So it's almost like it's different for one industry to another.

Darryl:
Yeah, 100%.

René:
Because if you write as a lawyer, if you write a letter or an email, you spend any time at all, for the most part, it's billed. Right. And if it's 0.25 of an hour or whatever. But if you get into any professional, creative business, like you say, marketing, photography, any of those types of services, web design, everyone seems to think that you just got endless amount of time and resources, and it's just like, like, have.

Darryl:
You ever went to the dentist with a cavity and said, can you do this for half the price? No. The fucking dentist would slap you in the face with his rubber glove.

René:
He'd bitch slap you and still charge you. That's true. I'm not dissing a dentist. It'd be nice if the creative industry would be a little bit more aligned with those values where it'd be like, you know what? You don't want my services. You obviously don't appreciate them and you don't see value.

Darryl:
Exactly. And I get it. The journey of marketing and advertising for small business, or really businesses of any size, is challenging. It's not cheap, but it's necessary. This is why I have this podcast, is. Yes, I'm giving you tips on how to do it yourself, but this is so you can grow to get better. Right? It's an opportunity to leverage expertise of professionals who can elevate your brand to new heights. So my takeaway here is helping you understand the value of those professional services, like respect the boundaries and expertise of these creatives and prioritize quality over shortcuts.

Darryl:
You're not only investing your brand success, but it creates a culture of mutual respect within the industry. Do you want to be known as the brand who cheaps out or is difficult? No. So remember the world of marketing. You truly get what you pay for. So invest wisely and I guarantee you'll have success.

René:
Like I said, it's not unique to marketing for sure. The ones that resonate the most for me is. Is the creative industry.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
So you, photographers, for example.

Darryl:
Website designers.

René:
Website designers. And then. And then the construction and renovation industry.

Darryl:
Yeah, for sure.

René:
Fucking insane for that. I've got tons of clients in that industry and they just try to get low balled all the time.

Darryl:
Yeah.

René:
Or they don't get paid for a service because they charge them for, like, the agreement is. Okay, you're gonna be $60 an hour or $65 an hour. But when you get build the hours, you're like, oh, that's too much. no, no, fuck!

Darryl:
It's too bad.

René:
You had me change that wall three times.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
Holy what a rant of an episode. We've never had one of these before. This is crazy. Let's not make it a habit. Let's pick happier topics.

Darryl:
They were hot takes. Hot takes.

René:
Yeah

Darryl:
Hot takes. We'll be right back.

Darryl:
I'm not sure if you saw this or not, but a few weeks ago, a lawsuit was launched by four school boards in Ontario and they are suing Facebook, Instagram, Snapchat and TikTok over those apps being harmful to student learning. But is it a lawsuit? I think they're going to win. No, but do I think it could help shed light on the bigger problem. Fuck, yeah. Like, back in the day. And here's my old man coming out. Back in the day. Sonny.

René:
Yeah, When I was a kid

Darryl:
When we were bored, we went outside. And I know we've said this, other people have said this. It's like you hear it, summer, winter, whatever. It's true. But now it's always, here's the iPad, or play on the phone. You know how many kids I see with devices in their hands these days?

René:
We, as parents, are 100% responsible. It's not the kids.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
Parents take the easy way out. You're at dinner. Oh, my God, I hate going to a restaurant.

Darryl:
I was just gonna say that.

René:
When the fucking kid is on the parents phone.

Darryl:
Yeah!

René:
You know what, put your phones away. Teach your kid to have some social skills, some, you know, some manners, and to be able to interact with a family setting at a restaurant without losing his fucking marbles.

Darryl:
Yeah, well, and that's the thing. We need to create these boundaries, right. And not give in. If you communicate with your children about the importance of bouncing screen time with other activities, it's an easier conversation. And the reason for this lawsuit, which, and kind of the reason I'm bringing this up right now, is coming from the marketer, there is actual science and data behind how dangerous social media is to kids.

René:
Yeah, see, and I disagree with you with having this conversation with your kids, of explaining to them. Cause they don't give a fuck. They're addicts.

Darryl:
Oh, they are addicts.

René:
They just don't give it to them. That's my thought.

Darryl:
Here's the thing, and I want to reveal a big secret about social media is that, yes, they are all tech giants with a lot of money because they built these social media platforms. And everything that they do, whether it's your content or somebody else's content, the reason you are seeing it is because that is going to make them money. So the TikToker who does makeup, the reason you're seeing it is because it's going to make TikTok some money. René, you're going to post a video later today of you sipping your coffee, which is boring as shit. And the reason I'm not seen is because it's not going to make anybody money. Yeah.

René:
I still think it's 100% the parents fault for sure. I don't care how good social media is. I don't care how good Facebook is. The parents have to take that shit away from the kids. I was on the road by myself for work. And I stopped in and had some lunch at a restaurant, and it was either parents with their kids or grandparents with their kids. And every fucking one of them was either on a phone or an iPad or had a headset on and was playing video games or whatever. Because it's not just social media.

Darryl:
No.

René:
Right. It's like you said at the beginning, it's technology. How is technology affecting the way our kids are being raised? Technology is super important and has taken huge leaps and bounds in how we do things.

Darryl:
Ah, in a short amount of time.

René:
In a short amount of time. But parents have totally shit the bed. So there was a couple there. There was no technology in sight. The kid was sitting in a kid chair. The kid got a bit restless at one point, so the mom had her on her lap for a little bit, and then she put her back down and the kid was eating normal. She was not having a tantrum. I bought them lunch and I wrote on a note and I said, keep doing a great job raising your child.

René:
Good job.

Darryl:
And it's amazing.

René:
The waitress came back.

René:
She said. They couldn't believe it.

René:
They couldn't believe it.

René:
But as a parent, you have the responsibility to raise human beings. You're not raising little fucking morons that are robots sitting on their phones.

Darryl:
Exactly.

René:
And that's what's so fucked up about society now. Holy. This is another rant. What's with you and the topics today?

Darryl:
They're hot takes! Hot takes!

René:
Or is it just in the air?

Darryl:
Well, that's the thing. With our kids, we used to get, people come up to us all the time and say, if we were in a restaurant, how are your kids so well behaved? And I get this question all the time. And I'm like, because we taught them to sit down and eat dinner as a family and have conversations,

René:
I have to tell you, you have really, really well behaved children.

Darryl:
Thank you.

René:
Very polite. They have great social skills.

René:
I don't want you to toot your own horns. Halt, too.

Darryl:
No, I was just going to say I don't want to build them up too high because in a private setting, boy, are they pains in the ass.

René:
Sometimes, especially when I go over for a visit.

Darryl:
But here's the thing. Here's what I find ridiculous about the whole situation of tech, whether it's social media, video games, whatever, is that okay? If someone said to you, I want to take your child for seven to eight hours a day and I'm going to put them in a sweatshop to make shoes, or I'm gonna, I'm gonna go even darker here. I'm gonna traffic them.

René:
Where are you going with this, Darryl?

Darryl:
Oh, hold on. Whatever the case may be. And this person said, I'm gonna do it to make money for me. There is no way you would let your child go. You'd be like, child labor? Forget it. Trafficking? Forget it. No way. Are you insane? I'm not gonna put my kid in harm's way just so you can make a dollar.

Darryl:
Guess what those video games do? Guess what social media does? They take your kids for seven or eight hours a day and they make money off them with harmful things that we know are harmful. With the video games, we talk to eye doctors and we know that screen time really affects your vision, especially as you get older. Kids are getting into glasses more because of screen time. Their brain function has lowered simply because of so much screen time. So we're not okay with those types of things, of let's use our kids to help other people make money. But with this, we're like, yeah, go ahead, take them for seven, eight hours a day. That's fine. Oh, you're making billions off of them.

René:
Moral of the story is it's less dangerous to make Nike shoes for free.

Darryl:
That's right. That's. But the most important point here that I think is important for parents, and you said it, you're like, take it away. But the other important thing is lead by example. There is so many times where I see families. We've went to a dinner party before where the dad could not get off his phone and the kids do the same thing. They grab the phone and I'm like, are we not here? Like, what the fuck am I doing at your house? Why'd you invite me over if you're going to be on your phone? I only do that when we go to a dinner party. I'll text my wife and be like, can we get the fuck out of here? But seriously, adults lead by example.

Darryl:
Put your fucking phone down for 2 seconds. It's not something we need. We've proven as a society from the dawn of time until these phones and screens came to be that we can actually function without them.

René:
Yeah, we're not experts in this, man. But there's got to be a tipping point at some point. Like in terms of civilization on its own. Like there's for sure there's just lack of human connection now. And it's really like expedited with the pandemic, even in adults now. Oh, I know where people are socializing less. There's less house parties, there's less you know, organized functions. There's less people in gatherings.

René:
People are just comfortable staying at home and living vicariously through social media and having. I don't know, it's weird.

Darryl:
I actually know adults, who will say, I have a friend who. And they tell me a story, and I'm like, oh, who's that? I've never met them. They're like, oh, it's this guy following on instagram. Yeah, he doesn't know you.

René:
Oh, my God. But it's true. It sounds so stupid, but it's true.

Darryl:
Listen, today wasn't about rants. I called them hot takes for a reason, because they are important topics that sometimes we need to talk about. They're not comfortable conversations, but they're important.

René:
I had to take my sweater off. I was sweating bullets in this chat. That's crazy.

Darryl:
Thanks for joining us. We'll see you guys next time.

René:
Bye.